Cattitude

BIO:

Stephen is the founder of Stephen Quandt Feline Behavior Associates, LLC, and is a Feline Training and Behavior Specialist certified through the Animal Behavior Institute (ABI) and a recent author with the release of his first children’s book, HAPPY COMES HOME available on Amazon. He is a professional cat behaviorist with over 20 years of experience working with cats in private consultations, animal shelters and in the field. A background of nationwide rescue work with the ASPCA greatly enriched his empathy with communities of cat lovers in need of help. Stephen Quandt was one of the first on the ground at Chernobyl who was tasked with rescuing animals, tending to their needs, and returning them to their humans/families if that was possible.  His current work with the Animal Care Centers of NYC advances that compassionate connection. See more at www.catbehaviorhelp.com and @catbehaviorhelp on FB/IG and @cat_behavior_help on TikTok.   

Transcript:

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Announcer: This is Pet Life Radio.

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Announcer: Let's talk pets.

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Michelle Fern: Hello, feline friends.

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Michelle Fern: Welcome to Cattitude.

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Michelle Fern: Happy 2025, wow.

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Michelle Fern: And we're already off to a crazy year.

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Michelle Fern: But, you know, at the start of the year, we always make resolutions and things we wanna do.

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Michelle Fern: So we're gonna get to that in this show.

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Michelle Fern: The first show I'm recording of 2025, I have a great guest today because he is a cat behaviorist.

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Michelle Fern: And don't we wanna know more about our cats and understand them?

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Michelle Fern: Well, here's some tips.

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Michelle Fern: Stay tuned, we'll be right back.

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Announcer: You know the expression, cats have nine lives.

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Announcer: Well, what if you can give them one more?

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Announcer: The Give Them Ten Movement is on a mission to help give cats an extra life.

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Announcer: How?

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Announcer: With spay and neuter.

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Announcer: Spaying or neutering your cat helps them live a longer, healthier life.

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Announcer: And it helps control free roaming cat populations too.

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Announcer: Learn more about the benefits of spay and neuter, and meet Scooter, the neutered cat, at givethemten.org.

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Announcer: That's GiveThemT-E-N dot org.

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Announcer: Let's talk pets on petliferadio.com.

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Michelle Fern: Welcome back, everyone.

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Michelle Fern: I'd like to welcome Stephen Quandt.

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Michelle Fern: He's a cat behavior expert.

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Michelle Fern: He has a private practice, and he also works with the Animal Care Centers of New York City.

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Michelle Fern: Welcome, Stephen.

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Stephen Quandt: Thank you, Michelle.

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Stephen Quandt: It is great to be here today.

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Michelle Fern: I'm very excited to have you on.

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Michelle Fern: Can you give us a little history about yourself?

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Michelle Fern: Because you have a really unusual, some interesting stories, and then tell us what exactly a cat behaviorist does.

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Stephen Quandt: Sure, happy to.

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Stephen Quandt: So in a kind of previous life, I was a theatrical lighting designer, go figure.

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Stephen Quandt: And I slowly made a transition in animal welfare that really kind of jump started when I responded as a volunteer to the Joplin, Missouri tornado in 2011.

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Stephen Quandt: And after that, I got a contract with the field investigation and response team at ASPCA.

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Stephen Quandt: And I worked for them for a whole bunch of years going around the country on large scale criminal cruelty and disaster cases.

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Stephen Quandt: And eventually got more training in feline behavior and ended up at the Animal Care Centers of New York City, where I do feline behavior as well.

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Stephen Quandt: So, and in between all of this, a few years ago, I went to Ukraine, to the site of the Chernobyl nuclear accident and worked with the wild dogs that live around the power plant in a spay-neuter research campaign.

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Stephen Quandt: So I feel like I've had a crazy life.

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Stephen Quandt: But that's in a nutshell, I guess, kind of what led up to today.

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Michelle Fern: Very interesting.

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Michelle Fern: So a lot of people have misconceptions about what a cat behaviorist does.

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Michelle Fern: What do they do?

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Stephen Quandt: Nice question.

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Stephen Quandt: You know, on the one hand, I think it's fair to say that we try our best to understand cats.

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Stephen Quandt: And in a sense, they're somewhat unknowable creatures, right?

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Stephen Quandt: I joke that I send emails to my client's cats and the cats just don't read the emails.

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Stephen Quandt: But to some extent, they're unknowable, but we try our best to understand them.

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Stephen Quandt: And then we try and interpret that understanding for people who either have behavior questions or more likely behavior problems.

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Stephen Quandt: So we're focused on cats, but we talk to the people and we talk to cats through behavior.

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Stephen Quandt: One way to talk to cats is actually engaging in behaviors with them to see what they respond to.

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Stephen Quandt: So I think my role as a behavior specialist is understanding them, interpreting that behavior, and helping the humans have the best possible life with their cats.

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Michelle Fern: So you talk to the humans and you talk to the cats.

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Stephen Quandt: Absolutely.

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Stephen Quandt: The cats I talk to by extension through the people because I ask the people, the humans, to do certain things with their cats to see if the cat responds by making a change in its behavior and his or her behavior.

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Stephen Quandt: And if the cat responds in a way that we're hoping or anticipating, then we know that the cat is in a dialogue with the human.

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Stephen Quandt: That's the best way for a cat to talk to us is to do something.

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Stephen Quandt: And if they don't do what we want or what we hope, then we're not talking and they're not listening and we have to try something else.

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Michelle Fern: Okay, interesting.

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Michelle Fern: Are expectations of us cat parents realistic?

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Michelle Fern: Most of the time.

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Michelle Fern: Some of the time, most of the time.

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Stephen Quandt: Yeah, it's a mix.

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Stephen Quandt: You know, it depends on what the issue is.

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Stephen Quandt: Sometimes yes, but let's not forget that sometimes their expectations are colored or influenced by their hope, their hopes, their concern, their worry.

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Stephen Quandt: I often talk to people who are very worried about their cat's behavior and hopeful at the same time.

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Stephen Quandt: And I have to help them compassionately make that connection back with their cat.

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Stephen Quandt: And as we do that, we are both of us, all of us, whether it's a single person or a couple and me, we're both kind of organically trying to understand where the cat is, what the opportunities are for success, why the cat is doing what it's doing.

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Stephen Quandt: And I can speak to that more if you'd like with respect to how I try and understand cats and what the driving forces are that affect cat behavior.

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Michelle Fern: Okay.

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Michelle Fern: Well, we're going to dive into some of that, but we've talked about this pre-show and here's my question to you and my guess.

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Michelle Fern: So we were talking about the most common reasons people contact you.

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Michelle Fern: I'm thinking it's, I have a tie.

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Michelle Fern: I can't tell one or the other.

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Michelle Fern: I'm thinking it's litter box and aggression.

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Stephen Quandt: Did you see me smiling as you were getting ready to say those two things to me?

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Stephen Quandt: Because yes, you're spot on, you're dead on.

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Michelle Fern: Well, I've had 200 something shows, so I think I guess I listen and learned something over the years.

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Stephen Quandt: Hey, maybe you should join me on a behavior consultation sometime, and I could bring you in as a part-time expert, full-time expert.

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Michelle Fern: My cat crew, that's what I have problems with, but I'm a cat parent just like all of our listeners.

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Michelle Fern: But yes, so tell us about those two.

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Stephen Quandt: Yeah.

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Stephen Quandt: So cat on cat aggression, usually a new cat being introduced into the home where there's a resident cat.

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Stephen Quandt: Sometimes cat aggression between two cats who have normally a friendly relationship, but something has interrupted or broken that relationship.

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Stephen Quandt: That is the number one reason why people seek me out.

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Stephen Quandt: So much so that it's, I feel like it's a subspecialty of what I do.

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Stephen Quandt: Litter box issues is right up there at number two.

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Stephen Quandt: Both of these are serious, serious problems and cause heartache.

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Stephen Quandt: And people need solutions for this.

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Stephen Quandt: It's not, you know, cat scratching on your sofa may not be enjoyable, but it's not necessarily causing you great distress.

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Stephen Quandt: So those two problems are, occupy the vast majority of why people contact me.

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Stephen Quandt: And yeah, so, and I can speak more to either of those issues if you'd like, but that's the short answer to your question.

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Michelle Fern: I just have a little comment because I had a great show that I did last year with American Cat.

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Michelle Fern: Oh, I can't remember the good, the bad, the cuddly.

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Michelle Fern: It was about de-clawing.

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Michelle Fern: And I've decided that there's way too many people that don't understand, even cat pet parents that don't understand that.

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Michelle Fern: I have never met a cat behaviorist that is for it.

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Michelle Fern: I don't know what your personal opinion is, but so de-clawing, as we know, is cutting the first knuckle.

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Michelle Fern: And that actually brings out more aggression.

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Michelle Fern: It doesn't stop aggression from a cat behaviorist point of view.

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Stephen Quandt: It can do a lot of negative things actually.

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Stephen Quandt: And I'll mention that New York State, which is where I'm located obviously, is the first state in the country to outlaw de-clawing, except in very, very rare circumstances, usually affecting the health of the human.

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Stephen Quandt: So New York is kind of on board with no longer tolerating this.

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Stephen Quandt: But yeah, it is a severing of the joint.

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Stephen Quandt: It can result in phantom pain.

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Stephen Quandt: Amputees can experience pain where their limb used to be.

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Stephen Quandt: And depriving cats of...

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Stephen Quandt: You know, this is an incredibly important thing for cats.

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Stephen Quandt: They express themselves with nails, with scratching things.

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Stephen Quandt: They have scent glands there where they deposit scent.

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Stephen Quandt: They relieve itching in themselves by giving themselves scratches.

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Stephen Quandt: They get balance from their nails.

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Stephen Quandt: They have safety with their nails and their claws.

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Stephen Quandt: They can develop litter box issues because of perceived discomfort in the litter box as a result of the surgery.

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Stephen Quandt: Everyone agrees, every vet will tell you that there is post-surgical pain.

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Stephen Quandt: Whether it's the standard amputation or it's a tendinectomy, which is the severing of the tendon, which just prevents the nail from coming out.

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Stephen Quandt: You still actually have to clip the nails because they're still there.

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Stephen Quandt: So there are all sorts of issues with declawing and I'm certainly not in favor of it really in any circumstance.

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Michelle Fern: Okay, I didn't think so.

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Michelle Fern: And yay, New York, my birth state.

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Michelle Fern: So I wish more states were on board and can bring about more aggression.

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Stephen Quandt: Yeah, there's some evidence to suggest that declawed cats can resort to their secondary defense, which is biting.

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Stephen Quandt: Normally, the order of defense is using claws first because that's safer from the cat's point of view.

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Stephen Quandt: They don't have to get their face involved.

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Stephen Quandt: If they can't scratch, they will bite.

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Stephen Quandt: And if they don't have the option to scratch, some cats may become biters.

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Stephen Quandt: I mean, I have come across plenty of declawed cats.

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Stephen Quandt: I can't say that I've seen this so much personally, but there is at least some evidence to suggest that it's true.

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Stephen Quandt: But regardless, it's not happy for a cat.

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Stephen Quandt: Cats are pure, perfect creatures.

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Stephen Quandt: They were created in this world to completely meld with their environment.

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Stephen Quandt: And we are modifying them in a really awful way just to kind of protect things like our furniture.

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Stephen Quandt: There are better ways to protect your furniture than de-clawing a cat.

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Michelle Fern: Exactly.

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Michelle Fern: And during that show, I said, you know, who needs to have a $5,000, $10,000 cat?

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Michelle Fern: But Jennifer Conrad, who's a huge person with the Paw Project and very involved with all that and the movie was focused on her, said, you know, I have clients in Beverly Hills and everything.

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Michelle Fern: They have $20,000 couches.

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Michelle Fern: You can teach a cat not to claw in front of it.

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Michelle Fern: I did it with mine.

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Michelle Fern: And if I could teach mine, that's saying a lot because I can be a better teacher.

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Michelle Fern: But yes, at least we know about the aggression part.

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Michelle Fern: I have a question.

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Michelle Fern: Let's go back to you, your service.

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Michelle Fern: And thank you for all that information, because I learned something.

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Michelle Fern: I had no idea there were scent glands in their nails.

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Stephen Quandt: In their paws, actually.

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Michelle Fern: In their paws, okay.

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Stephen Quandt: Yeah, there's scent glands all over cats, and these scents are used for different purposes.

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Michelle Fern: So interesting.

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Michelle Fern: So, for your services, you have a questionnaire pre-consultation.

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Michelle Fern: Is that the norm?

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Stephen Quandt: So, actually, to be clear, I have three questionnaires.

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Stephen Quandt: The most recent is only very recent.

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Stephen Quandt: So, I have a standard pre-consultation questionnaire, which just lets people talk about the behavior concerns generally.

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Stephen Quandt: There's a litter box questionnaire that really seeks to give me a clearer picture of what's going on if the cat's eliminating outside the litter box.

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Stephen Quandt: And I recently added a cat-to-cat aggression questionnaire that really dives deep into what's going on between the cats.

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Stephen Quandt: To your question, I would say it's reasonably common.

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Stephen Quandt: I've talked to other, I mean, I do talk to other behavior specialists, who I consider friends and colleagues.

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Stephen Quandt: And many of them have questionnaires, but I don't know that all of them have questionnaires.

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Michelle Fern: Okay.

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Michelle Fern: And then one last question.

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Michelle Fern: And then we're going to go to our second half.

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Michelle Fern: Do you ever have cat parents that come to you more for validation versus correction?

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Stephen Quandt: Not as a primary means of coming to me, but in the course of a conversation, sometimes in what can be a situation involving a certain amount of heartache, where they may be getting criticism or pushback from friends or relatives on whatever is being discussed.

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Stephen Quandt: And they will say, thank you for validating what I'm thinking.

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Stephen Quandt: And part of my job, honestly, I don't make this up, this is real, is providing compassion to people who are trying their hardest to help their cats.

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Stephen Quandt: And sometimes other people will say, you should get rid of your cat.

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Stephen Quandt: Why do you keep that cat?

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Stephen Quandt: That cat is being aggressive or is doing X or Y.

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Stephen Quandt: And that's a terrible thing.

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Stephen Quandt: Would you say to someone, you should get rid of your child?

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Stephen Quandt: No, absolutely not.

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Stephen Quandt: And it would be considered beyond rude to even entertain a comment like that.

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Stephen Quandt: So it's really no different.

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Stephen Quandt: Someone who makes a comment like that is not really thinking about the emotional implications of what they're saying to someone.

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Stephen Quandt: If someone's cat has recently passed away, I would never say to them, are you thinking about replacing him or her?

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Stephen Quandt: You're gonna get another cat?

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Stephen Quandt: That's for them to decide when they have gone through their own grieving process.

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Stephen Quandt: So it's important to be sensitive to people and their needs and the emotions that they're feeling.

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Stephen Quandt: If someone needs to surrender a cat and at the Animal Care Centers, we have cats that are surrendered all the time.

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Stephen Quandt: I try and counsel people that it is important not to feel guilty or to feel like a failure because it's bad enough that you're going to feel grief and loss.

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Stephen Quandt: And grief and loss can be made worse by feeling guilty or feeling like you're a failure.

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Stephen Quandt: People have tried hard to make things work.

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Stephen Quandt: So I do feel that I validate people, but it isn't necessarily why they're coming to me.

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Stephen Quandt: They discover it in the course of our conversation as a kind of secondary aspect of that conversation.

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Michelle Fern: Wonderful how you are able to respect their opinions and just help people along the way from whatever their process is.

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Michelle Fern: We're going to take a quick break and we'll come back and we're going to talk about what we talk about in January, resolutions, but these are resolutions for your cats.

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Michelle Fern: We'll be right back.

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00:16:18.925 --> 00:16:32.885
Announcer: PetLifeRadio.com Welcome back, everyone.

00:16:32.885 --> 00:16:34.785
Michelle Fern: We're talking to Stephen Kwant.

00:16:34.785 --> 00:16:37.305
Michelle Fern: He is a cat behavior expert.

00:16:37.792 --> 00:16:41.132
Michelle Fern: So now, let's talk about resolutions.

00:16:41.132 --> 00:16:52.152
Michelle Fern: So I was on your website, and we're gonna let people know, and then we're gonna let people know again when we're done talking, because I want people to make sure that they know how to get to your site.

00:16:52.152 --> 00:16:58.752
Michelle Fern: So one of the big resolutions for people is, of course, getting in shape, weight management, that sort of thing.

00:16:58.752 --> 00:16:58.892
Michelle Fern: Why?

00:16:59.232 --> 00:17:06.292
Michelle Fern: Because you want to be healthy, live longer, be able to, you know, sit down, touch your toes, put on your shoes, blah, blah.

00:17:06.292 --> 00:17:08.152
Michelle Fern: So we want this for our cat too.

00:17:08.152 --> 00:17:12.292
Michelle Fern: So our cat lives longer, is healthier, and so forth.

00:17:12.292 --> 00:17:14.152
Michelle Fern: But it is hard.

00:17:14.152 --> 00:17:18.712
Michelle Fern: Why is it so hard to help your cat lose weight?

00:17:18.712 --> 00:17:28.512
Stephen Quandt: Yeah, well, so cats typically in homes are spayed and neutered, and spayed and neutered cats, which there are many, many benefits to spaying and neutering your cat.

00:17:28.652 --> 00:17:30.752
Stephen Quandt: I am a big advocate of this.

00:17:30.752 --> 00:17:32.212
Stephen Quandt: They actually live longer.

00:17:32.212 --> 00:17:36.572
Stephen Quandt: They're less likely to get certain cancers, especially female cats.

00:17:36.572 --> 00:17:42.092
Stephen Quandt: They're less likely to have behavior problems, but their metabolism also can slow down a little bit.

00:17:42.092 --> 00:17:50.992
Stephen Quandt: And we also need to remember that cats, unlike dogs, which dogs are, you know, they're pack animals and operate differently.

00:17:50.992 --> 00:17:53.272
Stephen Quandt: They obtain their food differently than cats.

00:17:53.272 --> 00:17:58.392
Stephen Quandt: Cats are predators, and predators problem solve in order to get their food.

00:17:59.092 --> 00:18:02.112
Stephen Quandt: They exercise in order to get their food.

00:18:02.112 --> 00:18:11.032
Stephen Quandt: And there is a balance between the calories expended to obtain a food source and that food itself.

00:18:11.032 --> 00:18:12.752
Stephen Quandt: So that can be in balance.

00:18:12.752 --> 00:18:15.272
Stephen Quandt: Indoor cats, some cats are indoor outdoor.

00:18:15.272 --> 00:18:18.952
Stephen Quandt: And that's another question, another topic, where we can certainly tackle.

00:18:18.952 --> 00:18:20.672
Stephen Quandt: But a lot of cats are indoor cats.

00:18:20.712 --> 00:18:32.012
Stephen Quandt: And they are essentially, by the function of being inside companions, they are less likely to be engaging in predatory or even simulated predatory behaviors.

00:18:32.012 --> 00:18:34.792
Stephen Quandt: They're not expending energy in the same way.

00:18:34.792 --> 00:18:38.292
Stephen Quandt: They may become lazier, no fault of their own.

00:18:38.292 --> 00:18:45.912
Stephen Quandt: And the balance between the calories going out, the calories coming in isn't quite in balance.

00:18:45.912 --> 00:18:49.092
Stephen Quandt: And they tend to start putting on weight.

00:18:49.432 --> 00:18:53.232
Stephen Quandt: It's essentially a function of being an indoor cat.

00:18:53.232 --> 00:18:58.172
Stephen Quandt: If you look at outdoor cats, cats that live exclusively outdoors, they're not overweight.

00:18:58.172 --> 00:19:06.892
Stephen Quandt: If they're thriving in their environment, and not all cats do, but for cats that thrive outdoors, they generally are abnormal weight.

00:19:06.892 --> 00:19:11.452
Stephen Quandt: I like to kind of joke with clients, but I'm not actually joking.

00:19:11.452 --> 00:19:14.092
Stephen Quandt: Outdoor cats don't have behavior problems.

00:19:14.092 --> 00:19:17.212
Stephen Quandt: They have behavior, but they don't have behavior problems.

00:19:17.212 --> 00:19:33.392
Stephen Quandt: Pretty much all the behavior problems we see in cats are a function of coming indoors and not having as many places to eliminate urine and feces, not having the same amount of territory, not having the same opportunities for hunting.

00:19:33.392 --> 00:19:50.232
Stephen Quandt: So, and some cats do, many cats do great in indoor environments, but when we see cats with problems, we can usually trace it back to some connection to an evolutionary need or an adaptive force that is not well balanced indoors.

00:19:50.232 --> 00:19:57.072
Stephen Quandt: So, for cats, indoor cats who are spayed and neutered and not getting a lot of exercise, they can put on weight.

00:19:57.072 --> 00:20:02.732
Stephen Quandt: And how to get the weight off is an entirely different question, which maybe we should talk about.

00:20:02.732 --> 00:20:07.552
Michelle Fern: Yes, that's my next question, because you have a great blog article that everybody should read.

00:20:07.552 --> 00:20:08.612
Michelle Fern: What's your website?

00:20:08.612 --> 00:20:10.212
Stephen Quandt: My website is really simple.

00:20:10.212 --> 00:20:12.532
Stephen Quandt: You know, I love websites with catchy names.

00:20:12.532 --> 00:20:13.892
Stephen Quandt: Mine's not particularly catchy.

00:20:13.892 --> 00:20:17.152
Stephen Quandt: It just is kind of matter of fact, it's catbehaviourhelp.com.

00:20:19.352 --> 00:20:21.312
Michelle Fern: Catbehaviourhelp, I like it.

00:20:21.312 --> 00:20:23.292
Michelle Fern: Simple to the point, get it done.

00:20:23.292 --> 00:20:29.912
Michelle Fern: So let's talk about, as you were talking, I'm thinking a lot of cats that are indoor cats are couch cats.

00:20:29.912 --> 00:20:38.752
Michelle Fern: And I have my own opinion about, well, I live in a, it's like suburbs, so my cats are indoors, plus where I live, for weather reasons, they're indoors.

00:20:38.752 --> 00:20:43.772
Michelle Fern: And there's predators out there, like raccoons and possums and the occasional coyote.

00:20:44.172 --> 00:20:49.452
Michelle Fern: Even though I live in Greater Fort Lauderdale, so we have all these preachers, no alligators.

00:20:49.452 --> 00:20:51.352
Michelle Fern: I don't know, I don't have to see them.

00:20:51.352 --> 00:20:52.952
Michelle Fern: But so they're indoor cats.

00:20:52.952 --> 00:20:58.512
Michelle Fern: And yeah, that's a great, I've had shows about the indoor outdoor, but two of them are a little fat.

00:20:58.512 --> 00:21:00.652
Michelle Fern: And here's my issue.

00:21:00.652 --> 00:21:02.292
Michelle Fern: And I read your article.

00:21:02.292 --> 00:21:11.312
Michelle Fern: See, my problem is my significant other, he thinks they should have treats and they should have, they need their food, and then otherwise they demand it.

00:21:11.712 --> 00:21:16.432
Michelle Fern: So he's the one that gets woken up at five something in the morning.

00:21:16.432 --> 00:21:18.612
Michelle Fern: So that's the challenge I have.

00:21:18.612 --> 00:21:22.732
Michelle Fern: And I think you called it free feeding for treats.

00:21:22.732 --> 00:21:28.072
Stephen Quandt: Some people do what's called free feeding, which they typically leave a bowl of dry food out all the time.

00:21:28.072 --> 00:21:28.352
Michelle Fern: Okay.

00:21:28.352 --> 00:21:30.352
Stephen Quandt: And the cat has continuous access.

00:21:30.352 --> 00:21:31.992
Michelle Fern: Yeah, see, I told him not to do that.

00:21:31.992 --> 00:21:33.812
Michelle Fern: And there's a little argument there.

00:21:33.812 --> 00:21:35.372
Stephen Quandt: So I can help you.

00:21:35.372 --> 00:21:36.272
Stephen Quandt: I can help both of you.

00:21:36.272 --> 00:21:43.612
Stephen Quandt: Sometimes, you know, when I work with couples, sometimes they look at me and they say, are you a couples counselor?

00:21:43.612 --> 00:21:44.892
Stephen Quandt: I joke with them, I'm like, no.

00:21:44.892 --> 00:21:47.972
Stephen Quandt: But, you know, I do want to help you both work this out.

00:21:47.972 --> 00:21:49.372
Stephen Quandt: So I can give you a tip on that.

00:21:49.372 --> 00:21:52.692
Stephen Quandt: But go ahead and launch into it with me if you'd like.

00:21:52.692 --> 00:21:55.312
Michelle Fern: No, so I think that it's a battle.

00:21:55.312 --> 00:22:02.692
Michelle Fern: It's a battle that I lose because, you know, as any couples, you know, it's the spectrum slides, you know, it's not always 50-50.

00:22:03.352 --> 00:22:06.632
Michelle Fern: And he's so stubborn on these subjects.

00:22:06.632 --> 00:22:08.372
Michelle Fern: It's just like, okay, fine.

00:22:08.372 --> 00:22:10.272
Michelle Fern: So that's a challenge.

00:22:10.272 --> 00:22:11.952
Michelle Fern: And then the other challenge.

00:22:11.952 --> 00:22:14.992
Michelle Fern: So how do you come to terms with what they should eat?

00:22:14.992 --> 00:22:20.532
Michelle Fern: And I realized they could eat, you know, like a diet food or, and I do mix wet and dry.

00:22:20.532 --> 00:22:25.232
Michelle Fern: I'm on the border of doing my own version of lightly cooked raw.

00:22:25.232 --> 00:22:28.132
Michelle Fern: But there's just that challenge.

00:22:28.132 --> 00:22:30.392
Michelle Fern: So what we were almost at a time.

00:22:30.572 --> 00:22:33.572
Michelle Fern: So what do you have to suggest for that?

00:22:33.572 --> 00:22:41.712
Stephen Quandt: So let me give you a quick answer for your particular issue, which is many people's issue, which is cats who wake us up at 3, 4, 5 in the morning.

00:22:41.712 --> 00:22:46.172
Stephen Quandt: So every animal has a method of calorie retention.

00:22:46.172 --> 00:22:57.232
Stephen Quandt: And the way in which cats retain their calories is they hunt, they problem solve, they exercise, they find their prey, they kill it, they eat it, and then nature says, go to sleep.

00:22:58.132 --> 00:23:02.152
Stephen Quandt: Sleep so you don't use up those wonderfully earned calories.

00:23:02.152 --> 00:23:10.912
Stephen Quandt: So one way to address the cat who wakes us up at 5 in the morning is to engage them in this cycle of predation about an hour before your bedtime.

00:23:10.912 --> 00:23:14.712
Stephen Quandt: Give them a play session, play being a substitute for hunting.

00:23:14.712 --> 00:23:18.452
Stephen Quandt: Then give them an additional meal, right?

00:23:18.452 --> 00:23:24.492
Stephen Quandt: And that will help tell the cat they need to go to sleep because they did everything in the right order.

00:23:24.492 --> 00:23:30.872
Stephen Quandt: They hunted, they expended energy, they played, and then they eat, and then the switch gets turned from on to off.

00:23:30.872 --> 00:23:34.092
Stephen Quandt: Cats also eat 8, 10, 12 times a day.

00:23:34.092 --> 00:23:38.732
Stephen Quandt: So if we only feed our cats twice a day, they're going 12 hours between meals.

00:23:38.732 --> 00:23:41.732
Stephen Quandt: So you could buy some real time in the morning.

00:23:41.732 --> 00:23:43.312
Stephen Quandt: Your husband will thank you.

00:23:43.312 --> 00:23:47.912
Stephen Quandt: Give them some exercise and a third meal about an hour before your bedtime.

00:23:47.912 --> 00:23:52.372
Stephen Quandt: Do we have enough time to talk about some other aspects of weight loss?

00:23:52.372 --> 00:23:52.712
Michelle Fern: Yes.

00:23:52.712 --> 00:23:54.372
Michelle Fern: Well, I have one last question.

00:23:55.012 --> 00:23:57.652
Michelle Fern: How can you get your cats moving?

00:23:58.912 --> 00:23:59.672
Stephen Quandt: So yes.

00:23:59.672 --> 00:24:03.832
Stephen Quandt: So we want to interest them in exercise.

00:24:03.832 --> 00:24:07.532
Stephen Quandt: That doesn't mean sometimes just holding a feather wand gently.

00:24:07.532 --> 00:24:12.572
Stephen Quandt: We want to figure out what our cat wants to do and how to get them to do it.

00:24:12.572 --> 00:24:20.412
Stephen Quandt: That could mean, for example, a complicated puzzle feeder where they have to solve a problem in order to get the treat.

00:24:20.412 --> 00:24:22.712
Stephen Quandt: Cats are fundamental problem solvers.

00:24:22.812 --> 00:24:28.312
Stephen Quandt: So if we do clicker training with a cat, we can get a cat to follow a target stick.

00:24:28.312 --> 00:24:30.932
Stephen Quandt: And that could mean get them to an exercise wheel.

00:24:30.932 --> 00:24:33.092
Stephen Quandt: There are really great exercise wheels out there.

00:24:33.092 --> 00:24:35.472
Stephen Quandt: I don't know if I'm allowed to mention brand names.

00:24:35.672 --> 00:24:36.732
Michelle Fern: Yeah, that's fine.

00:24:36.732 --> 00:24:37.012
Michelle Fern: Yeah.

00:24:37.012 --> 00:24:41.412
Stephen Quandt: So one fast cat makes a really great exercise wheel.

00:24:41.412 --> 00:24:45.352
Stephen Quandt: And it's like the similar thing for a mouse or a gerbil, right?

00:24:45.352 --> 00:24:47.492
Stephen Quandt: They get on the wheel and they run.

00:24:47.492 --> 00:24:49.672
Stephen Quandt: This is about a three-foot diameter wheel.

00:24:50.512 --> 00:24:53.572
Stephen Quandt: And there are ways to train your cats to use things like that.

00:24:53.572 --> 00:24:54.492
Stephen Quandt: Lasers can be good.

00:24:54.492 --> 00:25:03.592
Stephen Quandt: You can pre-position little bits of treats around your home to teach the cat that if they follow the laser dot, they'll actually get something for their effort.

00:25:03.592 --> 00:25:09.472
Stephen Quandt: Motion-sensitive toys are a way where the cat touches the toy and it springs to life and jumps around.

00:25:09.472 --> 00:25:11.312
Stephen Quandt: Those can interest cats.

00:25:11.312 --> 00:25:17.192
Stephen Quandt: So finding creative solutions to bored cats is great.

00:25:18.972 --> 00:25:22.632
Stephen Quandt: You can also harness train your cat and take them for a walk.

00:25:22.632 --> 00:25:27.272
Stephen Quandt: Taking cats for walks is a great way of using up energy.

00:25:27.272 --> 00:25:37.952
Stephen Quandt: If you carefully harness train your cat and you take them outside in a safe environment where they're not likely to become scared, that's a great way for them and for you, mind you.

00:25:37.952 --> 00:25:39.892
Stephen Quandt: Everybody gets a little exercise that way.

00:25:39.892 --> 00:25:40.512
Michelle Fern: Yes.

00:25:40.512 --> 00:25:44.412
Michelle Fern: We have time for probably one minute more of a comment.

00:25:44.412 --> 00:25:45.912
Michelle Fern: So anything else you want to add?

00:25:46.152 --> 00:25:46.912
Stephen Quandt: Oh, well, yeah.

00:25:46.912 --> 00:25:50.452
Stephen Quandt: If you want your cat to lose weight, I would start with a vet visit.

00:25:50.452 --> 00:26:00.332
Stephen Quandt: I would get a digital baby scale and do weekly or bi-weekly weighings of your cat, keep a little logbook so that you can actually see if there's progress being made.

00:26:00.332 --> 00:26:05.692
Stephen Quandt: You always want your cat to lose weight slowly because rapid weight loss in cats is dangerous.

00:26:05.692 --> 00:26:07.232
Stephen Quandt: You don't want to do that.

00:26:07.232 --> 00:26:13.632
Stephen Quandt: You want to have a high protein diet because protein, cats can use protein for energy.

00:26:14.252 --> 00:26:27.372
Stephen Quandt: Unlike people who need carbs or fat to have energy, cats as obligate carnivores actually metabolize protein and can express that protein in terms of energy production.

00:26:27.372 --> 00:26:28.512
Stephen Quandt: So that's great.

00:26:28.512 --> 00:26:30.972
Stephen Quandt: And label recommendations on cat food.

00:26:30.972 --> 00:26:35.512
Stephen Quandt: Always assume that you're only feeding the cat that thing, but most people aren't.

00:26:35.512 --> 00:26:38.112
Stephen Quandt: They're feeding a wet food, a dry food, some combination.

00:26:38.112 --> 00:26:46.752
Stephen Quandt: So figuring out what the best amount of foods to feed your cat to not overfeed them is probably a question best for your vet.

00:26:46.752 --> 00:26:47.092
Michelle Fern: Okay.

00:26:47.092 --> 00:26:48.552
Michelle Fern: Thank you so much.

00:26:48.552 --> 00:26:54.972
Michelle Fern: And again, where people can find out more about you and your services and your blog, catbehaviourhelp.com.

00:26:56.032 --> 00:26:56.412
Michelle Fern: Okay.

00:26:56.412 --> 00:27:02.212
Michelle Fern: Thank you so much, Stephen, for coming on Cattitude and sharing all this knowledge.

00:27:02.212 --> 00:27:09.692
Michelle Fern: It's only January and it's already started off crazy, but I wish you a wonderful year and hopefully you can come on again sometime.

00:27:09.692 --> 00:27:10.552
Stephen Quandt: I would love to.

00:27:10.552 --> 00:27:12.392
Stephen Quandt: Thank you so much, Michelle, for having me.

00:27:12.572 --> 00:27:15.292
Stephen Quandt: I'm a fan and it was an honor to be here today.

00:27:15.332 --> 00:27:16.412
Michelle Fern: It's an honor to have you.

00:27:16.412 --> 00:27:17.072
Michelle Fern: My pleasure.

00:27:17.072 --> 00:27:18.592
Michelle Fern: Thank you so much.

00:27:18.592 --> 00:27:20.132
Michelle Fern: I hope you all enjoyed this show.

00:27:20.132 --> 00:27:22.672
Michelle Fern: It was wonderful having Stephen Quandt on.

00:27:22.672 --> 00:27:25.072
Michelle Fern: Remember his website is catbehaviourhelp.com.

00:27:26.892 --> 00:27:30.152
Michelle Fern: I want to thank everyone that's listening to Cattitude.

00:27:30.152 --> 00:27:32.932
Michelle Fern: Let's make it a great 2025.

00:27:33.052 --> 00:27:38.532
Michelle Fern: I wish you a wonderful and prosperous and healthy new year and peaceful too.

00:27:38.532 --> 00:27:41.132
Michelle Fern: And thanks to my cat crew that are thriving.

00:27:41.132 --> 00:27:43.392
Michelle Fern: Thanks to Dennis, Charlotte and Molly.

00:27:43.392 --> 00:27:51.172
Michelle Fern: And of course, the show would not be the same without the wonderful skills of my producer, Mark Winter.

00:27:51.172 --> 00:27:53.152
Michelle Fern: Thank you, Mark, for all you do.

00:27:53.152 --> 00:27:59.652
Michelle Fern: And thanks again, everyone for listening to Cattitude and making it one of the top cat podcasts.

00:27:59.652 --> 00:28:00.492
Michelle Fern: Wow.

00:28:00.492 --> 00:28:02.332
Michelle Fern: So thank you, thank you for your loyalty.

00:28:02.332 --> 00:28:03.552
Michelle Fern: I appreciate it.

00:28:03.552 --> 00:28:08.092
Michelle Fern: And hey, remember, lose the attitude, have Cattitude.

00:28:08.092 --> 00:28:13.172
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