Not Down with IVDD (Mobility Part 2)
Nessie and Echo are back for the second episode of their mobility issues series, diving into arthritis and joint health for pets! This episode covers conditions like luxating patellas, intervertebral disc disease, and aortic thromboembolism, while also offering tips for keeping your pets mobile and healthy. And, of course, they throw in some funny pet product reviews along the way! Our socials: Email us at letstalk@petliferadio.com, find us on social media facebook.com/PodcastLetsTalkAboutPets Instagram Talk_Pets_With_Us
Listen to Episode #3 Now:
Transcript:
00:00:46.397 --> 00:00:47.577
Echo: Hey, Pet Pals.
00:00:47.577 --> 00:00:51.237
Nessie: Back with another episode of Let's Talk About Pets.
00:00:51.237 --> 00:00:52.377
Nessie: I'm your host, Nessie.
00:00:52.377 --> 00:00:54.137
Echo: And me, Echo.
00:00:54.137 --> 00:00:56.717
Echo: Hello, hello.
00:00:56.717 --> 00:00:57.717
Echo: She's Echoing it.
00:01:00.577 --> 00:01:05.517
Echo: Part two about mobility issues and arthritis and those types of deals.
00:01:05.517 --> 00:01:10.757
Nessie: So, I would like to tell you about a story of one of my favorite doctors.
00:01:10.757 --> 00:01:13.237
Nessie: There was another person involved too, I don't remember who they were.
00:01:13.757 --> 00:01:21.337
Nessie: But we were all on the floor in treatment with a dog, and he was doing the exam, and he asked me to get up and get something.
00:01:21.337 --> 00:01:24.957
Nessie: He decided to cover it because it was a broken toe now, which is, yeah.
00:01:24.957 --> 00:01:27.737
Nessie: So he said, and I was like, could you go get this?
00:01:27.737 --> 00:01:29.157
Nessie: I don't remember what I was getting.
00:01:29.157 --> 00:01:34.097
Nessie: I went to get up, place my foot on the retractable leash, the case, the cassette thing.
00:01:36.277 --> 00:01:41.417
Nessie: Yeah, foot on the leash, got up, split it out from under me.
00:01:41.417 --> 00:01:41.817
Nessie: And Dr.
00:01:41.817 --> 00:01:42.777
Nessie: White, he's a large man.
00:01:42.777 --> 00:01:43.897
Nessie: He's six foot four.
00:01:43.897 --> 00:01:46.937
Nessie: He's on all fours like a tabletop position.
00:01:49.077 --> 00:01:50.037
Echo: He's already funny.
00:01:50.037 --> 00:01:55.757
Nessie: And in order to save myself from dying and breaking my hip, I landed on Dr.
00:01:55.757 --> 00:02:00.117
Nessie: White, who was holding this dog paw.
00:02:02.037 --> 00:02:04.577
Echo: And he did like a...
00:02:07.797 --> 00:02:10.397
Nessie: I'm like, thanks for staying with me.
00:02:10.397 --> 00:02:13.957
Echo: And I was like, maybe you could learn to use your feet or something.
00:02:13.957 --> 00:02:16.717
Echo: And I was like, I hope your back is okay.
00:02:16.717 --> 00:02:18.497
Nessie: And I ran to go get the stuff when we finished the foot.
00:02:18.497 --> 00:02:20.157
Nessie: And I was like, but really, is your back okay?
00:02:20.277 --> 00:02:23.377
Nessie: Because that was a lot of me that just landed on your back.
00:02:23.377 --> 00:02:25.317
Nessie: And he's like, I'm glad you're okay.
00:02:25.317 --> 00:02:31.097
Nessie: He already had back problems, but that was probably a contributing factor to the later back problems.
00:02:31.097 --> 00:02:33.677
Echo: That's how I catch an ear employee.
00:02:33.677 --> 00:02:40.577
Echo: I feel like you cannot escape the veterinary care industry without some sort of back issue.
00:02:40.577 --> 00:02:41.637
Echo: It's just, you just can't.
00:02:41.637 --> 00:02:44.897
Nessie: Even if it's from your co-worker or landing on.
00:02:44.897 --> 00:02:49.717
Nessie: And by the way, if you happen to hear this one, like shout out to you, thanks for breaking my fall dead.
00:02:49.877 --> 00:02:51.477
Echo: I feel like you're a real one.
00:02:51.477 --> 00:02:52.757
Echo: I see.
00:02:52.757 --> 00:02:54.957
Nessie: Son, a real what?
00:02:54.957 --> 00:02:56.817
Nessie: A one, a real one.
00:02:58.197 --> 00:02:59.037
Echo: I don't know.
00:02:59.097 --> 00:03:00.697
Echo: Don't ask me what the term means.
00:03:00.697 --> 00:03:01.617
Echo: Okay.
00:03:01.617 --> 00:03:03.477
<Nessie: Is it what the cool kid's saying?
00:03:03.477 --> 00:03:04.177
Nessie: Oh, well.
00:03:04.177 --> 00:03:06.197
Nessie: I just know that it's a good thing.
00:03:06.197 --> 00:03:06.637
Echo: Okay.
00:03:06.637 --> 00:03:08.717
Echo: I don't want to be bamboozled by new slang.
00:03:08.717 --> 00:03:11.657
Nessie: Bamboozled by all the slangs.
00:03:11.657 --> 00:03:13.457
Echo: So we're talking about mobility again.
00:03:13.457 --> 00:03:16.777
Echo: Do you have any pets with any mobility issues?
00:03:17.437 --> 00:03:19.757
Nessie: Well, my male dog Attila the Hun.
00:03:20.137 --> 00:03:22.397
Echo: Attila the Hun.
00:03:22.397 --> 00:03:25.037
Nessie: And Xena the Warrior Princess.
00:03:25.037 --> 00:03:26.737
Nessie: Attila and Xena for short, obviously.
00:03:26.737 --> 00:03:27.917
Echo: Obviously.
00:03:32.077 --> 00:03:33.637
Echo: Girlfriend.
00:03:33.637 --> 00:03:36.337
Echo: Oh, I was expecting like Alexander the Great.
00:03:36.337 --> 00:03:37.477
Nessie: No.
00:03:37.477 --> 00:03:40.297
Nessie: It's girlfriend, but you have to sing it.
00:03:40.297 --> 00:03:41.957
Echo: Girlfriend.
00:03:41.957 --> 00:03:43.137
Nessie: Okay.
00:03:43.217 --> 00:03:44.177
Echo: Girlfriend.
00:03:44.177 --> 00:03:44.717
Echo: Yes.
00:03:44.717 --> 00:03:44.977
Echo: Okay.
00:03:45.437 --> 00:03:49.137
Nessie: If you are like, girlfriend, she's not a fan of you, but you're like, girlfriend.
00:03:49.137 --> 00:03:49.657
Nessie: That's her name.
00:03:49.657 --> 00:03:50.617
Nessie: Her name is the song.
00:03:50.617 --> 00:03:51.497
Echo: Oh, yeah.
00:03:51.497 --> 00:03:52.277
Echo: I like that.
00:03:52.277 --> 00:03:53.457
Nessie: Yeah, yeah.
00:03:53.457 --> 00:03:56.037
Echo: My cats respond very differently.
00:03:56.037 --> 00:03:57.057
Echo: Each of them.
00:03:57.257 --> 00:03:59.657
Echo: Yep.
00:03:59.657 --> 00:04:02.417
Echo: There's just a lot of funny noises around my house.
00:04:02.417 --> 00:04:05.757
Nessie: So, Ashley, for you, I have...
00:04:07.137 --> 00:04:09.977
Nessie: I'm going to try a little schmoozes.
00:04:09.977 --> 00:04:10.257
Nessie: Okay.
00:04:10.617 --> 00:04:11.697
Nessie: Did she ask you a question already?
00:04:11.697 --> 00:04:13.937
Echo: Because if she did, I forgot.
00:04:13.937 --> 00:04:15.017
Echo: Did we have a question?
00:04:15.017 --> 00:04:16.897
Echo: Yeah, I asked if you're in your pet's head.
00:04:17.717 --> 00:04:18.757
Announcer: Oh, I forgot.
00:04:18.757 --> 00:04:20.577
Nessie: I got involved with their names.
00:04:20.577 --> 00:04:26.097
Nessie: He is 10 now, and so he's a little bit slow getting up and down, and it's probably about time.
00:04:26.097 --> 00:04:35.597
Nessie: Like, his last exam in July, I didn't show, like, any range of motion problems or anything, but I'm going to assume probably by his next visit, we'll probably get him on Sunday.
00:04:35.597 --> 00:04:35.837
Echo: And you?
00:04:35.877 --> 00:04:37.077
Nessie: Nope, not currently.
00:04:37.077 --> 00:04:42.537
Echo: No, even like, well, I started with Samantha as my German shepherd.
00:04:42.537 --> 00:04:45.957
Echo: She had mechs, but she's got that look, you know.
00:04:47.257 --> 00:04:49.717
Echo: She's a pretty good dog, pretty big dog.
00:04:49.737 --> 00:04:57.417
Echo: I started her on Joint Supports when she was four, just kind of preemptively, and her primary at the time was all for it.
00:04:57.417 --> 00:04:59.617
Echo: Chetney, Chetney Pacapi is my little guy.
00:05:01.437 --> 00:05:02.717
Nessie: He gets around too.
00:05:02.737 --> 00:05:05.697
Nessie: He was kind enough to step on the laptop and everything.
00:05:05.697 --> 00:05:08.477
Echo: Yeah, he kind of ruined our recording last time.
00:05:08.477 --> 00:05:10.317
Echo: He is 14.
00:05:10.317 --> 00:05:22.297
Echo: I got him a year ago, and he wasn't on anything for joints or anything, so I did put him on some anti-inflammatory Joint Supports and stuff, just kind of right out the gate.
00:05:22.297 --> 00:05:32.077
Echo: As far as I know, he's never had x-rays for arthritis or anything, but we talked about it, you know, just as pets age, they just have some natural classification of their joints and stuff.
00:05:32.077 --> 00:05:42.477
Echo: So I kind of am really, really big believer in preemptively getting a lot of support and then when the primary vet agrees to go ahead and start anti-inflammatory.
00:05:42.477 --> 00:05:44.437
Nessie: So roses are red.
00:05:44.437 --> 00:05:48.777
Nessie: No.
00:05:48.777 --> 00:05:50.557
Echo: They're not this time.
00:05:50.557 --> 00:05:51.497
Echo: They are though.
00:05:52.177 --> 00:05:54.357
Nessie: Roses are gray.
00:05:54.357 --> 00:05:56.917
Nessie: Violets are gray.
00:05:56.917 --> 00:05:59.437
Nessie: Everything is gray because I'm an adult.
00:06:00.797 --> 00:06:03.697
Nessie: I do think that that one violet true.
00:06:03.737 --> 00:06:07.877
Nessie: I have face-day cans in some colors, but the idea behind it is embarrassing.
00:06:07.877 --> 00:06:10.057
Nessie: Also, your bark is contagious.
00:06:10.317 --> 00:06:13.477
Echo: That is not my bark, your bark is contagious.
00:06:15.177 --> 00:06:17.437
Nessie: That also could be kennel cough, so.
00:06:20.477 --> 00:06:22.277
Echo: I gotta be careful on that.
00:06:22.277 --> 00:06:23.597
Echo: You could take my Bortella.
00:06:23.597 --> 00:06:24.277
Nessie: Oh no.
00:06:24.357 --> 00:06:25.217
Echo: Oh dear.
00:06:25.217 --> 00:06:31.557
Echo: So last time we talked about general arthritis, head dysplasia, we talked about CCL tears.
00:06:31.557 --> 00:06:33.817
Echo: Let's start today with talking about luxating patella.
00:06:33.817 --> 00:06:36.497
Nessie: You don't have any experience with both?
00:06:36.897 --> 00:06:38.417
Nessie: I do.
00:06:38.417 --> 00:06:43.097
Echo: Not myself personally, but my little dog, he's gone now.
00:06:43.097 --> 00:06:44.917
Echo: His name was Sam Lotarli.
00:06:44.917 --> 00:06:46.557
Echo: Lotarli, I called him Tater.
00:06:46.557 --> 00:06:49.697
Echo: He had luxating patella in both knees.
00:06:49.697 --> 00:06:55.617
Echo: And so the patella, we did briefly touch on last time, the patella is the kneecap.
00:06:55.617 --> 00:07:02.877
Echo: In a normal stifle joint, in a normal knee joint, the patella sits in this groove in the femur.
00:07:02.877 --> 00:07:15.977
Echo: The patella tendon attaches the patella to the tibia, and the patella, the patella tendon and the sine muscle, which is the quadriceps, those all form the extensor mechanism, and they're usually well aligned.
00:07:15.977 --> 00:07:24.617
Echo: But a luxating patella is when the patella luxate, or it dislocates, and it moves outside of the femoral groove.
00:07:24.617 --> 00:07:26.977
Echo: It can move medially or laterally.
00:07:26.977 --> 00:07:29.817
Echo: Do you want to define medial versus lateral?
00:07:29.817 --> 00:07:34.797
Nessie: Medial is when you move inward as to where lateral is more outward.
00:07:35.057 --> 00:07:45.717
Echo: Yeah, so a good way to remember that is if something is moving medially, it is moving toward the median of the body or the center of the body, and laterally is away from center, so it's more toward the outside.
00:07:45.757 --> 00:07:47.597
Echo: Moving downward!
00:07:48.857 --> 00:07:49.577
Nessie: Yeah, yeah.
00:07:49.837 --> 00:07:51.417
Nessie: I didn't find that.
00:07:51.417 --> 00:07:52.577
Echo: Oh, okay, sorry.
00:07:52.577 --> 00:07:57.597
Echo: Early signs of luxating patella in dogs will be seen as a little skip.
00:07:57.597 --> 00:08:02.077
Echo: So like when the dog carries one limb in the air for a few steps, and that's what little Tarly did.
00:08:02.077 --> 00:08:08.297
Echo: He would be bopping along, and then he would just kind of like do a little skip on one of his back legs.
00:08:08.297 --> 00:08:11.837
Echo: And he had luxating patella in both back legs.
00:08:11.837 --> 00:08:14.217
Echo: So he kind of skipped on one leg and then skipped on the other.
00:08:14.217 --> 00:08:22.677
Echo: It was real cute, but I mean, as the disease increases in severity, you'll see noticeable lameness and an increase in consistency as well.
00:08:22.677 --> 00:08:31.197
Echo: According to the American College of Veterinary Surgery, this is one of the most common orthopedic conditions in dogs, and it results in discomfort and loss of function.
00:08:31.197 --> 00:08:38.637
Echo: I was reading that it happens primarily in small dogs, which makes sense because little Tarling was 15 pounds at his healthiest.
00:08:38.917 --> 00:08:41.897
Echo: It is diagnosed in 7% of puppies.
00:08:41.897 --> 00:08:44.497
Echo: That was a big number for puppies.
00:08:44.497 --> 00:08:53.077
Nessie: I feel like I don't remember any puppy exams that I've been part of so far that they've diagnosed a leptin and patella at this point.
00:08:53.077 --> 00:08:59.397
Nessie: But I mean 7%, when you think of the amount of puppies that come, it's not that big of a number.
00:08:59.397 --> 00:09:08.157
Echo: 7% sounds low, but I was more surprised that it was even a measurable number in puppies.
00:09:08.157 --> 00:09:14.917
Echo: I would have expected this to be something that would develop, but it's not necessarily exclusive to developmental.
00:09:15.597 --> 00:09:21.817
Echo: Sometimes they're born with it, sometimes they're just in the little little, a lot of time you guys.
00:09:21.817 --> 00:09:29.237
Echo: So puppies that have lexating patella can appear bow-legged in smaller breeds and nock-kneed in larger breeds.
00:09:29.237 --> 00:09:30.217
Nessie: I love the nock-kneed.
00:09:30.217 --> 00:09:30.997
Nessie: Nock-kneed.
00:09:30.997 --> 00:09:33.077
Echo: And it does worsen with rough.
00:09:33.077 --> 00:09:35.717
Nessie: Do you know how they grade lexating patella?
00:09:35.717 --> 00:09:36.397
Echo: I don't.
00:09:36.437 --> 00:09:37.437
Nessie: A score of 1 to 4.
00:09:38.297 --> 00:09:39.177
Echo: Oh, okay.
00:09:39.177 --> 00:09:48.857
Nessie: So, 1 and 2 being the low end and they're like the more mild cases.
00:09:48.857 --> 00:09:59.497
Nessie: And 3 and 4 being the ones that surgery is recommended for because it can start to affect the quality of life of the patient just because of the pain that the knees will be in.
00:09:59.497 --> 00:10:00.157
Echo: Yeah.
00:10:00.157 --> 00:10:01.937
Echo: And don't they get stuck too?
00:10:01.937 --> 00:10:03.717
Echo: Like the patella can get stuck outside of the...
00:10:04.077 --> 00:10:06.237
Echo: Yeah, and that's very unworldly.
00:10:06.237 --> 00:10:13.137
Nessie: But the 1s and the 2s could escalate to 3 and the 4s and need surgery correction at some point anyway.
00:10:13.137 --> 00:10:18.497
Nessie: So, it's really important to monitor them and do what you can to support their knee health.
00:10:18.497 --> 00:10:23.037
Echo: So, I've never actually heard of surgery to fix luxing.
00:10:23.037 --> 00:10:26.297
Echo: So, I always just kind of thought it was something that they just had.
00:10:26.297 --> 00:10:26.977
Echo: They just found this.
00:10:27.837 --> 00:10:32.237
Nessie: Yes, lateral suture is used to treat patellar luxation.
00:10:32.237 --> 00:10:38.997
Echo: Patellar luxation is relatively rare in cats, according to an AVMA article that I was reading.
00:10:38.997 --> 00:10:44.797
Echo: In cats, it happened due to congenital deformation or to trauma.
00:10:44.797 --> 00:10:54.117
Echo: They said that congenital deformation is believed to be more common, and there's a weak connection that exists between feline patellar luxation and hip dysplasia.
00:10:54.457 --> 00:11:05.817
Echo: If symptoms are seen in cats, it's most often seen as a shuffling gait or as lameness, though frequently enough, feline patellar luxations are often an incident.
00:11:05.817 --> 00:11:08.597
Nessie: Yeah, we haven't seen too many of those cases.
00:11:08.597 --> 00:11:23.177
Nessie: When we do see cats, a lot of the times for any type of mobility issue, it turns out being that we found some arthritis on an annual exam that the owner wasn't even aware of, or they came in for limping and they have like a fracture of some kind, or something weird like that.
00:11:23.837 --> 00:11:28.997
Nessie: We don't, as I mentioned in the other episode, we don't see as many cats as we do dogs.
00:11:28.997 --> 00:11:34.097
Nessie: So we don't see all that much arthritis compared to what we see with dogs.
00:11:34.097 --> 00:11:34.777
Nessie: Yeah.
00:11:34.777 --> 00:11:35.597
Echo: I just thought about this.
00:11:35.597 --> 00:11:41.317
Echo: If anyone doesn't know what we mean by incidental finding, you just happen to find it.
00:11:41.317 --> 00:11:43.057
Echo: It's not what you're looking for.
00:11:43.057 --> 00:11:46.017
Echo: It's something that a doctor might notice on an exam.
00:11:46.017 --> 00:11:47.857
Nessie: You're here for your annual checkup.
00:11:47.857 --> 00:11:49.817
Nessie: And while you're there, they're listening to the heart.
00:11:49.817 --> 00:11:54.357
Nessie: They happen to hear a murmur for the first time, and they grade that out, that's an incidental finding.
00:11:54.357 --> 00:11:55.957
Nessie: That's not what you were there for.
00:11:55.957 --> 00:11:59.617
Nessie: The same with the physical exam, checking the knees and stuff.
00:11:59.617 --> 00:12:02.817
Nessie: And that's when they happen to find a Luxane patella this time.
00:12:02.817 --> 00:12:04.537
Nessie: And it wasn't noted before.
00:12:04.537 --> 00:12:05.977
Nessie: You're not in for limping.
00:12:05.977 --> 00:12:06.257
Nessie: Yeah.
00:12:06.257 --> 00:12:08.637
Echo: Okay, now to the review.
00:12:09.557 --> 00:12:11.917
Echo: Well, let me lay one on.
00:12:11.917 --> 00:12:13.417
Echo: Okay, I'm ready, I'm ready.
00:12:13.417 --> 00:12:14.897
Nessie: I am always scared when you say that.
00:12:17.017 --> 00:12:21.657
Nessie: This is a review for the MidBest on Amazon.
00:12:21.657 --> 00:12:33.677
Nessie: It's a cold laser therapy device for vets, red light therapy for dog and cat, infrared light therapy target joint muscles, pay relief arthritis, spinal wound healing.
00:12:33.677 --> 00:12:36.877
Echo: This is the red light from the review from last episode.
00:12:36.877 --> 00:12:38.897
Nessie: I didn't find it because of that.
00:12:39.177 --> 00:12:42.417
Nessie: They just went down the rabbit hole of the link.
00:12:42.417 --> 00:12:44.257
Nessie: So this could be the red light one.
00:12:44.257 --> 00:12:48.657
Nessie: They got her one star from a different person though, so not the same person.
00:12:48.657 --> 00:12:50.317
Nessie: This is Georgina.
00:12:50.317 --> 00:12:54.597
Echo: Oh, different night when the red lights went out in Georgina.
00:12:54.597 --> 00:12:56.797
Nessie: Yeah, that was a bit of a stretch.
00:12:56.797 --> 00:12:59.677
Nessie: Those red lights there, the red light special.
00:12:59.677 --> 00:13:02.937
Nessie: That's a little TLC, we're getting a little off topic.
00:13:02.937 --> 00:13:03.557
Echo: That's okay.
00:13:03.557 --> 00:13:04.937
Nessie: Verify purchase one star.
00:13:05.137 --> 00:13:09.277
Nessie: Georgina said, Where are the how to instructions?
00:13:09.277 --> 00:13:10.397
Echo: Oh, no.
00:13:10.397 --> 00:13:16.257
Nessie: Only instructions provided were, charge the device before use, turn on, and caution.
00:13:16.257 --> 00:13:18.677
Nessie: Nothing provided on how to use it on your pet.
00:13:18.677 --> 00:13:19.377
Nessie: Nothing.
00:13:19.377 --> 00:13:24.117
Nessie: I can't figure out how all the five star ratings figured out how to use this on their pet.
00:13:24.117 --> 00:13:29.017
Nessie: Anyhow, this is useless for me, unless some guidance is provided.
00:13:29.017 --> 00:13:31.457
Nessie: Hopefully, I can return it.
00:13:31.457 --> 00:13:33.337
Echo: There's all these five star reviews on here.
00:13:33.437 --> 00:13:35.897
Nessie: How do they even know how to use this thing?
00:13:35.897 --> 00:13:40.637
Nessie: These directions just have a bunch of cautions on it, and they tell you to charge it.
00:13:40.637 --> 00:13:45.397
Nessie: Like that's a good step one, a good step two, and that's it.
00:13:45.397 --> 00:13:48.197
Nessie: And cautions, cautions, cautions, cautions.
00:13:48.197 --> 00:13:48.677
Echo: Yeah.
00:13:48.677 --> 00:13:53.497
Echo: Any product that has a ton of cautions on it does make me a little bit apprehensive.
00:13:53.497 --> 00:13:54.397
Nessie: That's fair.
00:13:54.397 --> 00:13:55.257
Echo: That's fair.
00:13:55.717 --> 00:13:57.817
Echo: That's a lot of power tools right there.
00:13:57.817 --> 00:14:01.057
Nessie: I get people who ask all the time, how do you find these reviews?
00:14:01.057 --> 00:14:02.997
Nessie: I never see crazy stuff like that online.
00:14:03.137 --> 00:14:09.777
Nessie: I am chronically reading reviews, because you've got to like scroll through and get through the nitty gritty of the year.
00:14:09.777 --> 00:14:10.677
Nessie: And say it takes stuff.
00:14:10.677 --> 00:14:13.237
Nessie: It takes time and dedication to dig these out.
00:14:13.237 --> 00:14:14.517
Echo: That's really good.
00:14:14.517 --> 00:14:16.537
Echo: And I'm glad that you're the one that wants to dig for those.
00:14:16.537 --> 00:14:18.437
Echo: I'd rather do the research part.
00:14:18.437 --> 00:14:20.997
Nessie: I have some really great things off of Nextdoor.
00:14:20.997 --> 00:14:22.817
Echo: What are you fond of Nextdoor?
00:14:22.817 --> 00:14:27.257
Nessie: They may be wild, but I haven't yet needed to dip into that research.
00:14:27.257 --> 00:14:28.277
Echo: You just got plenty.
00:14:28.277 --> 00:14:28.957
Echo: You just got plenty.
00:14:30.297 --> 00:14:35.037
Nessie: But I am very excited about these Nextdoor ones that I found.
00:14:35.037 --> 00:14:38.297
Nessie: They don't relate to this episode, so they'll be all about the episode.
00:14:38.297 --> 00:14:39.237
Nessie: People will just be crazy.
00:14:39.237 --> 00:14:40.357
Echo: I'm lying.
00:14:41.497 --> 00:14:45.057
Echo: That is one reason Stacey tells me all the time.
00:14:45.057 --> 00:14:45.877
Echo: She's like, have you heard this?
00:14:45.877 --> 00:14:46.677
Echo: And I'm always like, nope.
00:14:46.677 --> 00:14:48.937
Echo: And she goes, because you're not chronically online.
00:14:49.017 --> 00:14:50.177
Nessie: I'm not either.
00:14:50.177 --> 00:14:52.557
Nessie: The only social media I do is for the podcast.
00:14:52.557 --> 00:14:53.317
Nessie: Oh, really?
00:14:54.077 --> 00:14:55.517
Nessie: I don't have the TikToks.
00:14:55.517 --> 00:15:00.217
Nessie: In fact, when I told my nieces, when I was like, hey, are you guys on that TikTok?
00:15:00.217 --> 00:15:02.937
Nessie: And they were like, oh my god, Nessa.
00:15:02.937 --> 00:15:04.817
Nessie: First of all, it's TikTok.
00:15:04.817 --> 00:15:08.077
Nessie: And secondly, you sound like an old lady right now.
00:15:08.077 --> 00:15:09.817
Echo: Thank you for that.
00:15:10.077 --> 00:15:14.717
Nessie: Because my dad used to be like the My Spacers, the internet.
00:15:15.797 --> 00:15:18.357
Echo: So I was like, oh my god, dad.
00:15:19.237 --> 00:15:19.877
Echo: Get off this phone.
00:15:19.877 --> 00:15:21.637
Echo: I want to get on Dialog.
00:15:21.637 --> 00:15:22.937
Echo: I'm expecting a really important call.
00:15:22.937 --> 00:15:23.797
Nessie: Get off AOL.
00:15:23.797 --> 00:15:24.217
Echo: That's right.
00:15:24.217 --> 00:15:25.597
Nessie: It was the CDs they sent you.
00:15:27.857 --> 00:15:29.397
Nessie: All the projects people made.
00:15:29.397 --> 00:15:30.737
Echo: AOL noise.
00:15:30.737 --> 00:15:35.897
Echo: When you're first logging in that crazy noise, I will never forget it.
00:15:35.897 --> 00:15:36.897
Nessie: I did forget it.
00:15:36.897 --> 00:15:38.617
Echo: Oh, you're so lucky.
00:15:39.657 --> 00:15:40.937
Echo: I hear it.
00:15:40.937 --> 00:15:42.077
Nessie: Dialog sounds.
00:15:42.077 --> 00:15:44.677
Echo: Let's move on to IVDD, which stands.
00:15:44.677 --> 00:15:46.617
Nessie: IVDD, yeah, you know me.
00:15:47.197 --> 00:15:48.577
Echo: You know it's IVDD.
00:15:52.157 --> 00:15:53.657
Nessie: I don't know that song very well.
00:15:55.677 --> 00:15:59.817
Nessie: You know, OPP, yeah, you know me, there's IVDD.
00:15:59.817 --> 00:16:02.097
Echo: Yes, it's better your version for sure.
00:16:02.097 --> 00:16:04.797
Nessie: I just, I don't know what an OPP is.
00:16:04.797 --> 00:16:06.737
Echo: Maybe we should Google it so it's not something offensive.
00:16:06.737 --> 00:16:08.257
Nessie: Popping lip, popper.
00:16:09.557 --> 00:16:11.497
Echo: Oh, you know what, you know how I know this song?
00:16:11.497 --> 00:16:14.817
Echo: It's from Sister Act Two.
00:16:14.817 --> 00:16:19.077
Nessie: When that one guy starts singing a song, he's like, get down with G-O-D, yeah, you know.
00:16:19.937 --> 00:16:22.977
Nessie: Yeah, I guess we'll go and chain up the letters that can't be offensive.
00:16:22.977 --> 00:16:25.557
Nessie: And a lot of these people out here probably don't even know that song.
00:16:25.557 --> 00:16:27.437
Nessie: It's from like the 1900s or whatever.
00:16:27.437 --> 00:16:30.177
Echo: It's by Naughty By Nature.
00:16:30.177 --> 00:16:31.457
Echo: What does OPP stand for?
00:16:31.457 --> 00:16:33.197
Echo: Dave, drop a load on him.
00:16:33.197 --> 00:16:35.017
Echo: That sounds dirty.
00:17:06.897 --> 00:17:08.217
Echo: Oh, my goodness.
00:17:08.257 --> 00:17:09.737
Echo: This is wild.
00:17:09.777 --> 00:17:13.397
Echo: Um, I am in this episode, I, VD.
00:17:13.397 --> 00:17:15.237
Nessie: Get down with I, VD.
00:17:15.237 --> 00:17:16.157
Echo: Yeah, you know me.
00:17:16.157 --> 00:17:16.597
Echo: Yeah, you know me.
00:17:46.657 --> 00:17:51.637
Echo: So, I'm going to talk about the spinal cord, and it causes an entire range of very painful mobility issues.
00:17:51.637 --> 00:17:58.577
Echo: So, a healthy animal spine is made up of the spinal cord, just surrounded by vertebrae, which are the backbones.
00:17:58.577 --> 00:18:10.257
Echo: And in between each vertebra bone are these little gel-filled discs, and these discs cushion the vertebra, kind of like shock absorbers, and they allow the animal to bend and to flex their spine.
00:18:10.297 --> 00:18:11.257
Echo: And that's a healthy spine.
00:18:11.257 --> 00:18:15.317
Echo: But these discs in between the vertebrae can calcify with age.
00:18:15.777 --> 00:18:17.457
Echo: Do you want to talk about what calcification is?
00:18:17.457 --> 00:18:23.097
Nessie: When you have calcium that swarms in and around the tissues, making it firm up and whatnot?
00:18:23.097 --> 00:18:23.777
Echo: Yep.
00:18:23.777 --> 00:18:24.997
Echo: It helps them to kind of find-
00:18:24.997 --> 00:18:28.317
Nessie: My definition is not nearly as sophisticated as what you'll find online.
00:18:28.317 --> 00:18:31.117
Nessie: This is called the Dictionary of Nessie.
00:18:31.117 --> 00:18:32.317
Echo: That's a great dictionary.
00:18:32.317 --> 00:18:38.497
Nessie: And what it is, it's a little hood, a little simplified, a little inaccurate.
00:18:38.497 --> 00:18:40.417
Echo: But you need to understand that.
00:18:40.417 --> 00:18:41.477
Echo: For the simple folk.
00:18:42.497 --> 00:18:44.217
Nessie: As for myself.
00:18:45.917 --> 00:18:50.157
Nessie: This is wild and gone in a direction I'm quite fond of.
00:18:50.157 --> 00:18:53.197
Nessie: So I'm going to continue with the more acceptable definitions.
00:18:53.197 --> 00:18:55.277
Echo: I mean, you're spot on, really.
00:18:55.277 --> 00:18:59.237
Echo: It just means that calcium builds up in the tissues and it causes them to harden.
00:18:59.237 --> 00:19:05.997
Echo: Sometimes a pet can have like a traumatic injury or like a disc could just rupture, which puts pressure on the spinal cord.
00:19:05.997 --> 00:19:09.897
Echo: And this causes pain and neurological signs and can cause paralysis.
00:19:10.397 --> 00:19:19.897
Echo: According to Cornell University College of Veterinary Medicine, IVDD is the most common source of paralyzing back pain in dogs.
00:19:19.897 --> 00:19:25.277
Nessie: Do you know how young the dog can be, a dachshund especially, where you can start noticing signs of it?
00:19:25.277 --> 00:19:27.517
Echo: I'd imagine pretty young, pretty quickly.
00:19:27.517 --> 00:19:30.097
Nessie: You can start seeing signs of it at about two years old.
00:19:30.097 --> 00:19:30.677
Echo: Oh, okay.
00:19:30.677 --> 00:19:31.977
Nessie: Two years old.
00:19:31.977 --> 00:19:42.877
Nessie: It's not saying that they're going to start having back problems then, but you can start to see the lessening of flexibility and signs of some breakdown in the spine at as early as two years old.
00:19:42.877 --> 00:19:47.317
Nessie: That's one of the things with dachshunds, their breed is just known for this issue.
00:19:47.317 --> 00:19:48.017
Echo: Yeah.
00:19:48.017 --> 00:19:59.417
Echo: Most commonly seen in dachshunds, beagles, pecanese, shih tzus, Vasa hounds, or American Cocker Spaniels, but it can occur in dogs of any breed.
00:19:59.417 --> 00:20:05.457
Echo: Carolina Veterinary Specialists listed the most common breeds, and yeah, dachshunds are number one.
00:20:05.657 --> 00:20:13.837
Echo: The symptoms really can range according to where the spine is affected and the severity of it, but common signs.
00:20:13.837 --> 00:20:15.597
Echo: I have a really big list of common signs.
00:20:15.597 --> 00:20:17.237
Echo: Head held low.
00:20:17.237 --> 00:20:20.017
Echo: Don't your head held low, does it wobble to and fro?
00:20:20.017 --> 00:20:21.477
Echo: Can you die in a knot?
00:20:21.477 --> 00:20:22.917
Echo: Can you die in a bow?
00:20:22.917 --> 00:20:25.637
Nessie: Probably not if you have ID, D, D, D, D.
00:20:26.877 --> 00:20:27.897
Echo: That's too many Ds.
00:20:27.897 --> 00:20:28.497
Echo: A lot of Ds.
00:20:29.017 --> 00:20:35.597
Echo: Well, this is a fantasy show.
00:20:37.277 --> 00:20:40.817
Echo: Um, not if we're gonna be singing a song by Nani by Nature.
00:20:40.817 --> 00:20:41.617
Nessie: We did not.
00:20:41.617 --> 00:20:45.457
Nessie: We changed it to one about the hernia, IVFD by Nature.
00:20:45.457 --> 00:20:46.617
Echo: Yeah, you know me.
00:20:46.617 --> 00:20:48.037
Nessie: Yeah, I do know you.
00:20:48.037 --> 00:20:49.397
Echo: Your name is Echo.
00:20:49.397 --> 00:20:50.037
Echo: That's right.
00:20:50.037 --> 00:21:01.457
Echo: Head held low, arching back, shivering and crying, reluctance to move, unstable when standing, knuckling of all four paws.
00:21:01.457 --> 00:21:03.737
Echo: Do you wanna talk about what knuckling is?
00:21:03.737 --> 00:21:07.357
Nessie: That is when their feet are turned upside down.
00:21:07.357 --> 00:21:09.717
Nessie: Conscious proprioception.
00:21:09.717 --> 00:21:11.117
Echo: Yes, proprioception.
00:21:11.117 --> 00:21:12.957
Echo: I have never used that term.
00:21:12.957 --> 00:21:13.537
Echo: Yes.
00:21:13.537 --> 00:21:17.197
Nessie: Well, every time he says it, I know Zadwe is talking about, I never use the word.
00:21:17.197 --> 00:21:17.617
Echo: Yeah.
00:21:17.617 --> 00:21:26.717
Nessie: But it's when you take the paws and you tip them under yourself, and if the dog knows where his feet are, and he knows that their feet aren't supposed to be that way, he can correct them.
00:21:26.717 --> 00:21:33.797
Nessie: And if he cannot, usually there's a nerve factor involved where he's not aware of how his feet are and how to place them correctly.
00:21:33.797 --> 00:21:34.297
Echo: Yes.
00:21:34.297 --> 00:21:35.517
Echo: So that's knuckling.
00:21:35.517 --> 00:21:41.877
Echo: Because when you flip those feet, they are basically putting their weight on the knuckles instead of the paw pads.
00:21:41.877 --> 00:21:43.037
Echo: So that's why it's called knuckling.
00:21:43.177 --> 00:21:45.677
Nessie: He's really walking like a chafe.
00:21:45.677 --> 00:21:46.117
Echo: Yes.
00:21:46.117 --> 00:21:49.837
Nessie: And actually, I think he's supposed to call in the people who cave now or something.
00:21:49.837 --> 00:21:51.057
Nessie: I don't know.
00:21:51.057 --> 00:21:51.857
Echo: Oh, really?
00:21:51.857 --> 00:21:53.977
Nessie: No, no, I don't know.
00:21:53.977 --> 00:21:58.437
Nessie: I think that pavement's considered offensive now, but I'm not sure.
00:21:58.437 --> 00:21:59.637
Echo: Who's gonna be offended by that?
00:21:59.637 --> 00:22:01.037
Nessie: The cavemen are all gone.
00:22:01.037 --> 00:22:03.057
Nessie: I don't know, but I don't want to get canceled for saying it.
00:22:03.057 --> 00:22:04.257
Nessie: Okay, all right, that's fair.
00:22:04.257 --> 00:22:16.937
Nessie: So if there are any cave people around that were offended by that, any Neanderthals, I am so sorry, and I shall supply some logs for your fire.
00:22:19.457 --> 00:22:25.637
Nessie: Maybe a sharp axe, you can collect your own Fonny troglodytes listening to her scream.
00:22:27.537 --> 00:22:38.037
Echo: Some other common signs of IVDD in dogs, the inability to feel all four feet, muscle spasms, tense belly, crossing their back legs when walking.
00:22:38.037 --> 00:22:38.857
Echo: I've seen that.
00:22:39.157 --> 00:22:39.957
Nessie: Very unusual.
00:22:40.157 --> 00:22:41.557
Echo: I've not seen that.
00:22:41.557 --> 00:22:43.217
Echo: I'm curious about that one.
00:22:43.217 --> 00:22:49.117
Echo: Dragging toes when walking, a limp tail, difficulty jumping, and incontinence.
00:22:49.117 --> 00:22:54.637
Echo: The Central Texas Veterinary Specialty in Emergency have a page about IVDD in cats.
00:22:54.637 --> 00:23:04.737
Echo: They say it's really rare in cats, but when it does present, symptoms are often seen in middle-aged and older cats that tend to be neutered, indoor, and high on the BCS scale.
00:23:04.737 --> 00:23:07.497
Echo: And I don't think we've talked about the BCS scale yet.
00:23:08.497 --> 00:23:11.277
Echo: Do you want to briefly talk about what that means?
00:23:11.277 --> 00:23:14.497
Nessie: That's the Body Condition Score Scale.
00:23:14.497 --> 00:23:21.597
Nessie: And it's 1 through 9, with 1 being more towards anorexic and 9 being towards obese.
00:23:21.597 --> 00:23:22.697
Nessie: Ideal is 4 and 5.
00:23:22.697 --> 00:23:23.057
Echo: Yes.
00:23:23.057 --> 00:23:23.757
Nessie: I forgot that part.
00:23:23.757 --> 00:23:24.337
Echo: Yes.
00:23:24.337 --> 00:23:28.197
Echo: So high on the BCS scale means overweight or even obese.
00:23:28.197 --> 00:23:39.957
Echo: If a cat gets diagnosed with IVDD, it's usually found in their lower lumbar spine, and their symptoms can include weakness in the back legs, dropped rear end, a weakened or even paralyzed tail.
00:23:39.957 --> 00:23:42.337
Echo: And as with all pets, it could be pain.
00:23:42.337 --> 00:23:44.977
Nessie: Ah, well, shall we review?
00:23:48.017 --> 00:23:56.897
Nessie: This is a Pet Pain Away, and it is a homeopathic antonymy inflammation for joy that we found in the ingredients.
00:23:56.897 --> 00:23:59.597
Nessie: The active ingredient is Asian viper venom.
00:24:00.437 --> 00:24:02.617
Echo: Cobra venom?
00:24:02.637 --> 00:24:04.997
Nessie: I am Asian Cobra Venom.
00:24:04.997 --> 00:24:06.577
Nessie: Cobra viper, they're all the same to me.
00:24:06.577 --> 00:24:08.157
Nessie: I'm not a fan of snakes.
00:24:08.157 --> 00:24:09.497
Echo: That could kill me.
00:24:09.497 --> 00:24:12.877
Nessie: So, this is a one-star from Holly Jolly Christmas.
00:24:12.877 --> 00:24:14.757
Echo: Is she a one-star review?
00:24:14.757 --> 00:24:15.057
Nessie: The one.
00:24:15.057 --> 00:24:16.217
Echo: So she's not very jolly.
00:24:16.217 --> 00:24:18.297
Nessie: No, she's benign.
00:24:18.297 --> 00:24:21.277
Nessie: Also, it's not close enough to Christmas for her yet, I guess.
00:24:21.277 --> 00:24:23.417
Echo: Yeah, she's Holly frustrated.
00:24:23.417 --> 00:24:25.617
Echo: She's just Holly frustrated.
00:24:25.617 --> 00:24:27.277
Nessie: And it didn't work.
00:24:27.277 --> 00:24:32.057
Nessie: My dog just got lethargic from it, and now I can't get him to stop sending it.
00:24:32.057 --> 00:24:33.117
Nessie: No phone number.
00:24:33.117 --> 00:24:33.697
Echo: Nothing.
00:24:33.697 --> 00:24:36.537
Echo: Help!
00:24:36.537 --> 00:24:39.137
Nessie: She can't get her dog to stop sending it?
00:24:39.137 --> 00:24:41.837
Nessie: Okay, so her dog got lethargic, she's not using it.
00:24:41.837 --> 00:24:45.937
Nessie: Now she can't get the people that she ordered it from to stop sending it.
00:24:45.937 --> 00:24:50.537
Nessie: And she has no number to call to get them to take it off of the automatic renewal or whatever.
00:24:50.757 --> 00:24:52.997
Nessie: And she says, help in all capital letters.
00:24:52.997 --> 00:24:54.117
Nessie: Nothing is helping her.
00:24:54.117 --> 00:24:56.617
Nessie: They just keep sending her all these bottles of the stuff that she's not using.
00:24:56.617 --> 00:24:57.797
Echo: That sounds like a scale.
00:24:58.197 --> 00:25:01.517
Echo: Have you ever been taken in by one of those scams?
00:25:01.517 --> 00:25:02.857
Nessie: I have been taken in.
00:25:02.857 --> 00:25:03.237
Echo: Yeah.
00:25:03.477 --> 00:25:09.817
Echo: They're like, hey, you need more energy or you want to lose weight or you want to whatever.
00:25:09.817 --> 00:25:10.877
Echo: Take these pills.
00:25:10.877 --> 00:25:12.497
Echo: The first bottle is free.
00:25:12.497 --> 00:25:17.537
Echo: But then they just automatically keep sending it to you even after you're like, this is snake oil.
00:25:17.537 --> 00:25:18.577
Echo: This is junk.
00:25:18.577 --> 00:25:19.837
Echo: This doesn't work at all.
00:25:19.837 --> 00:25:20.657
Echo: Hey, stop sending it.
00:25:20.657 --> 00:25:21.777
Echo: And they're like, too bad.
00:25:21.777 --> 00:25:22.417
Echo: We already sent it.
00:25:22.417 --> 00:25:23.237
Echo: We're charging you now.
00:25:23.477 --> 00:25:24.977
Echo: And you're like, no.
00:25:24.977 --> 00:25:27.597
Nessie: So I don't think she got it off of Amazon.
00:25:27.597 --> 00:25:32.097
Nessie: I think she got it because it was a made for TV product before it made it to Amazon.
00:25:32.437 --> 00:25:33.137
Nessie: Hooked it up.
00:25:33.137 --> 00:25:34.957
Nessie: And so I think she ordered it from them.
00:25:34.957 --> 00:25:38.337
Nessie: And now they can keep automatically once a month, send her another bottle.
00:25:38.337 --> 00:25:40.977
Nessie: And she can't get them to stop it.
00:25:40.977 --> 00:25:46.657
Nessie: And so she went to Amazon to tell them that they won't stop sending it and ask Amazon for help.
00:25:46.657 --> 00:25:48.237
Echo: That is a way to do it.
00:25:48.237 --> 00:25:49.617
Echo: I don't know if that's the most effective way.
00:25:49.617 --> 00:25:51.417
Nessie: Can't you just give them to stop it?
00:25:51.417 --> 00:25:52.297
Echo: That's what I was just thinking.
00:25:52.677 --> 00:25:54.577
Echo: Like you just tell the bank, hey, this is a scam.
00:25:54.577 --> 00:25:56.237
Nessie: Please stop.
00:25:56.237 --> 00:25:57.137
Nessie: I'd like to stop paying.
00:25:57.137 --> 00:25:58.877
Echo: Like, I cannot pay them anymore.
00:25:58.877 --> 00:26:01.137
Nessie: I've never once been like, you know what?
00:26:01.137 --> 00:26:03.277
Echo: How about Amazon can help me?
00:26:03.277 --> 00:26:05.517
Echo: Amazon has a really, really good customer service.
00:26:05.517 --> 00:26:05.797
Nessie: Right.
00:26:05.797 --> 00:26:07.957
Nessie: If they bought the product through them.
00:26:07.957 --> 00:26:08.857
Echo: Right.
00:26:08.857 --> 00:26:09.377
Nessie: You do do it.
00:26:09.377 --> 00:26:12.977
Nessie: There's still reach out and they're like, listen, got this Mayfair TV product.
00:26:12.977 --> 00:26:14.497
Nessie: It's not doing its thing.
00:26:14.977 --> 00:26:16.417
Nessie: They won't quit, you know?
00:26:16.417 --> 00:26:17.677
Nessie: Can you just get on to them for me?
00:26:17.677 --> 00:26:19.877
Nessie: I know that you are the Amazon overlord.
00:26:20.377 --> 00:26:24.557
Nessie: And I just know that Bezos is here for me.
00:26:24.557 --> 00:26:26.497
Echo: Haha, is he?
00:26:26.497 --> 00:26:29.997
Nessie: Well, well, I'm really sorry you keep getting snake venom.
00:26:29.997 --> 00:26:30.797
Echo: Yeah.
00:26:30.797 --> 00:26:32.177
Echo: I don't know what to think about that product.
00:26:32.457 --> 00:26:34.057
Echo: That's just wild to me.
00:26:34.057 --> 00:26:34.937
Echo: Wild.
00:26:34.937 --> 00:26:36.777
Echo: So, until these numbers, that's normal.
00:26:36.777 --> 00:26:40.497
Echo: Hahahaha.
00:26:40.497 --> 00:26:43.637
Echo: We are moving on to degenerative myelopathy.
00:26:43.637 --> 00:26:45.077
Echo: This is not a fun one.
00:26:45.077 --> 00:26:46.997
Nessie: Do you know what degenerative myelopathy is?
00:26:47.277 --> 00:26:53.557
Nessie: When the joints and stuff are degenerating, like in the back, in the hips.
00:26:53.557 --> 00:27:01.077
Nessie: I mean, yeah, they can no longer at one point get up anymore, and you have to get them in special slings, or weld carts and stuff.
00:27:01.077 --> 00:27:03.117
Echo: It's a fatal degeneration of the spine.
00:27:03.117 --> 00:27:03.397
Echo: Yeah.
00:27:03.397 --> 00:27:07.437
Echo: So, it starts in the hind limbs, and then it does progress to all levels.
00:27:07.437 --> 00:27:09.137
Nessie: We knew a dog better than this.
00:27:09.137 --> 00:27:10.417
Echo: He was my guy.
00:27:10.417 --> 00:27:11.377
Echo: He was.
00:27:11.377 --> 00:27:12.717
Nessie: Best driver shepherd I've ever...
00:27:13.337 --> 00:27:16.697
Echo: Like, the nicest dog, and the most wonderful family.
00:27:17.657 --> 00:27:19.217
Echo: It was a sad day.
00:27:19.217 --> 00:27:23.417
Nessie: I was there for the season with the family, and tell me all our favorite stories.
00:27:23.737 --> 00:27:24.977
Echo: I would attend it.
00:27:24.977 --> 00:27:30.497
Echo: Just tell me about how naughty he was as a puppy.
00:27:30.497 --> 00:27:32.037
Echo: Troublemaker.
00:27:32.037 --> 00:27:34.857
Echo: Two years old, he finally became a nice dog.
00:27:36.397 --> 00:27:40.857
Echo: I feel like that's about the time that Stacey stopped complaining about her border collie puppy, two years old.
00:27:40.857 --> 00:27:45.697
Echo: Up until about 15 years ago, the cause of degenerative myelopathy was unknown.
00:27:45.697 --> 00:27:55.317
Echo: But in 2009, a mutation was found in a specific gene called the superoxide dismutase 1, which is really fun to say.
00:27:55.317 --> 00:27:55.917
Echo: Wow.
00:27:55.917 --> 00:27:59.937
Echo: It's also called the SOD1, is the name of the gene.
00:28:01.057 --> 00:28:01.977
Echo: SOD1.
00:28:01.977 --> 00:28:07.317
Echo: And this mutation was described to underlie the cause of degenerative myelopathy.
00:28:07.317 --> 00:28:15.637
Echo: So dogs that have two copies of the mutated gene, right, one from each parent, they are at risk for developing degenerative myelopathy.
00:28:15.637 --> 00:28:20.277
Echo: But not every dog that has two copies of the mutated gene will get it.
00:28:20.277 --> 00:28:22.317
Echo: They're just at risk for it.
00:28:22.317 --> 00:28:30.037
Echo: According to the University of Missouri, mutations in this gene are associated with some forms of human ALS as well.
00:28:30.037 --> 00:28:30.697
Echo: Oh, wow.
00:28:30.697 --> 00:28:31.357
Echo: Yeah.
00:28:31.357 --> 00:28:34.017
Echo: So that was really interesting, very interesting.
00:28:34.017 --> 00:28:42.117
Echo: But as stated, degenerative myelopathy is ultimately fatal, and the onset is typically about nine years of age.
00:28:42.117 --> 00:28:46.617
Echo: It can start with some ataxia and spastic limb weakness.
00:28:46.617 --> 00:28:47.837
Echo: Do you want to define ataxia?
00:28:47.837 --> 00:28:50.377
Nessie: Ataxia is when they walk around like they're drunk.
00:28:50.377 --> 00:28:50.817
Echo: Yeah.
00:28:50.817 --> 00:28:55.637
Echo: It's like poor muscle control and clumsy movements, a lack of coordination.
00:28:55.657 --> 00:28:57.277
Nessie: Once again, Nessie dictionary.
00:28:57.717 --> 00:28:58.697
Echo: The Nessie dictionary is fun.
00:28:58.697 --> 00:29:00.717
Echo: A dog walk, a taxi.
00:29:00.757 --> 00:29:05.157
Echo: I feel bad for everybody who takes a page out of Nessie's dictionary.
00:29:06.197 --> 00:29:13.137
Nessie: It gets me through, and I know what I'm talking about, but whether I can convey my thoughts appropriately to someone else, I don't know.
00:29:13.137 --> 00:29:14.877
Echo: That's why I have to write all my notes down.
00:29:14.877 --> 00:29:17.717
Echo: I'd just be like, just telling stories the whole time.
00:29:17.717 --> 00:29:22.417
Nessie: I like when you remind me of something that I have in my noggin that I can use.
00:29:22.417 --> 00:29:23.917
Nessie: I like that you rely on that.
00:29:27.597 --> 00:29:39.417
Nessie: I have vital information that are worded terribly, but well understood for the people and the pets, for everybody.
00:29:41.317 --> 00:29:44.897
Echo: Well, this episode is gone.
00:29:46.297 --> 00:29:51.917
Echo: The first noticeable stage of degenerative myelopathy is going to be dragging nails when walking.
00:29:52.297 --> 00:30:00.557
Echo: And that progresses to hind limb weakness, it progresses to incontinence, and eventually it will lead to difficulty swallowing.
00:30:00.557 --> 00:30:09.457
Echo: The first time you see your dog dragging his nails when walking, that's a sign that you need to pay attention to and start a conversation with your veterinarian about it.
00:30:09.457 --> 00:30:20.497
Echo: Because if we are looking at a progression of degenerative myelopathy, that is something that is pretty quickly a fail as well.
00:30:20.717 --> 00:30:29.977
Echo: The University of Missouri says that the disease does not seem to cause any pain to the pet, which is one of the few mercies, I think, with this disease.
00:30:29.977 --> 00:30:35.397
Echo: But most pets will be completely incapable of walking within a year of initial sign.
00:30:35.397 --> 00:30:39.177
Echo: That's hard for dogs like German Shepherds that are very big.
00:30:39.177 --> 00:30:44.317
Echo: I mean, once they can't walk anymore, most of those dogs, you can't just pick up and go, you know.
00:30:44.317 --> 00:30:48.757
Echo: If you have that in a shih tzu, well, that's one thing, you know, you can pick them up and help them.
00:30:48.877 --> 00:30:53.317
Echo: But with big dogs, it's a lot more difficult.
00:30:53.317 --> 00:30:58.217
Echo: The progression is so fast and they go downhill, unfortunately, very quickly.
00:30:58.217 --> 00:30:59.217
Echo: We need some joy.
00:30:59.217 --> 00:31:01.877
Echo: We need some joy, dog, dog.
00:31:01.877 --> 00:31:03.477
Echo: I'm in this place.
00:31:03.477 --> 00:31:03.997
Echo: That's right.
00:31:03.997 --> 00:31:05.217
Echo: I'm in that place.
00:31:05.217 --> 00:31:05.617
Echo: Whoa!
00:31:09.537 --> 00:31:13.377
Nessie: This is another one for the Venom, Venom.
00:31:13.477 --> 00:31:14.277
Echo: Another one.
00:31:14.277 --> 00:31:16.817
Echo: People have a lot to say about this product.
00:31:16.817 --> 00:31:20.277
Nessie: It's a one-star view from Richie Riches.
00:31:20.277 --> 00:31:21.537
Echo: Richie Riches?
00:31:21.537 --> 00:31:21.917
Nessie: Yeah.
00:31:21.917 --> 00:31:22.097
Echo: Yeah.
00:31:22.097 --> 00:31:23.017
Nessie: He's very cool guy.
00:31:23.017 --> 00:31:23.637
Echo: All right.
00:31:23.637 --> 00:31:25.057
Echo: All natural?
00:31:25.057 --> 00:31:26.017
Nessie: Question mark?
00:31:26.017 --> 00:31:27.597
Nessie: Maybe, but...
00:31:28.597 --> 00:31:30.297
Nessie: I don't know what's going on with this title.
00:31:30.297 --> 00:31:31.657
Announcer: I'm very confused.
00:31:31.657 --> 00:31:32.877
Echo: That was just the title?
00:31:32.877 --> 00:31:33.197
Echo: Yeah.
00:31:33.197 --> 00:31:35.997
Echo: Richie Riches is a little confused.
00:31:35.997 --> 00:31:41.997
Nessie: There's one, two, three, four, five types of punctuation in the title.
00:31:42.057 --> 00:31:43.137
Echo: In just the title.
00:31:43.137 --> 00:31:43.937
Echo: Yeah.
00:31:43.937 --> 00:31:49.097
Nessie: So, there's a lot to unpack in just that, but let's see what he says.
00:31:49.097 --> 00:31:51.297
Nessie: I saw this advertised on TV.
00:31:51.297 --> 00:31:55.177
Nessie: It wanted to help ease my very senior cat's obvious pain.
00:31:55.177 --> 00:32:02.477
Nessie: When I got the product, I was shocked and horrified to see that the active ingredient was snake venom.
00:32:02.477 --> 00:32:04.937
Nessie: What does homeopathic mean anyway?
00:32:04.937 --> 00:32:11.977
Nessie: Call me crazy, but I didn't want to take a chance that my 19-year-old cat would have a bad reaction, so I returned it.
00:32:11.977 --> 00:32:13.877
Echo: That's a wise person right there.
00:32:13.877 --> 00:32:14.777
Echo: Job, Richie Rich.
00:32:14.777 --> 00:32:16.597
Nessie: I can tell you what homeopathic means.
00:32:16.597 --> 00:32:17.377
Echo: If you're wondering.
00:32:17.377 --> 00:32:17.897
Echo: Yes.
00:32:17.897 --> 00:32:23.617
Nessie: An alternative medicine base on the theory of treating like with like.
00:32:23.617 --> 00:32:26.137
Echo: What?
00:32:26.137 --> 00:32:27.537
Echo: Treating like with like?
00:32:27.537 --> 00:32:27.977
Echo: Yeah.
00:32:27.977 --> 00:32:35.857
Nessie: Supposedly, it stimulates healing responses by administering substances that mimic the symptoms of those diseases.
00:32:36.317 --> 00:32:38.177
Echo: What?
00:32:38.177 --> 00:32:40.317
Echo: I like, I understand what you're saying.
00:32:40.317 --> 00:32:41.797
Echo: I do not understand how that works.
00:32:41.797 --> 00:32:43.417
Nessie: Well, I don't either.
00:32:43.417 --> 00:32:45.817
Nessie: And apparently, they don't either.
00:32:45.817 --> 00:32:47.917
Nessie: What does homeopathic mean anyway?
00:32:47.917 --> 00:32:48.737
Echo: You ordered it.
00:32:49.217 --> 00:32:52.577
Echo: Didn't you think you should have looked at how far you're supposed to look?
00:32:54.537 --> 00:32:59.757
Echo: I have always thought of homeopathy as like the...
00:32:59.777 --> 00:33:00.877
Nessie: Like the all natural way.
00:33:00.877 --> 00:33:02.477
Echo: The body can cure itself.
00:33:02.677 --> 00:33:10.997
Echo: And so the only thing that the body really needs is like small doses of natural things, like ventigers and leaves.
00:33:10.997 --> 00:33:13.237
Nessie: It's like treating pain with pain.
00:33:15.357 --> 00:33:19.617
Nessie: Treat your arthritis with burning, stinging pain from vampire venom.
00:33:19.617 --> 00:33:23.417
Nessie: No.
00:33:23.417 --> 00:33:27.737
Echo: Listen, if you don't know where to get vampire venom, you are going to make a killing.
00:33:27.737 --> 00:33:27.997
Nessie: Right.
00:33:29.317 --> 00:33:29.677
Nessie: Right.
00:33:29.677 --> 00:33:31.377
Nessie: All of that is good.
00:33:31.377 --> 00:33:33.337
Echo: What for a minute?
00:33:35.097 --> 00:33:38.637
Echo: Do you want to move on to something else that's equally sad?
00:33:38.637 --> 00:33:40.777
Echo: We're going to need another really good review after this one.
00:33:40.777 --> 00:33:43.117
Echo: This would be a really good time for a commercial.
00:34:13.137 --> 00:34:16.557
Announcer: Kat is off the floor and is conveniently located on the cat tree.
00:34:16.557 --> 00:34:23.937
Announcer: Go to www.kattreetree.com Bring home a luxury French bulldog from the world famous Tom King's Kennel.
00:34:23.937 --> 00:34:27.337
Announcer: Premium French bulldogs from excellent European bloodlines.
00:34:27.337 --> 00:34:31.977
Announcer: Superior puppy care and lifetime health guarantee for your perfect companion.
00:34:32.017 --> 00:34:35.817
Announcer: Use code TomKingsMagic for a magical holiday discount.
00:34:35.817 --> 00:34:39.717
Announcer: Visit www.tomkingskennel.com and find your perfect Frenchie today.
00:34:40.577 --> 00:34:43.397
Announcer: Your pets will be over the moon with sparkly jewelry.
00:34:43.397 --> 00:34:48.317
Announcer: From Over the Moon Jewelry, beautiful handcrafted matching jewelry for you and your pets.
00:34:48.317 --> 00:34:52.737
Announcer: Wire wrapped, beaded contemporary necklaces, bracelets and charms.
00:34:52.737 --> 00:34:54.397
Announcer: Go to overthemoonjewelry.com.
00:35:09.717 --> 00:35:10.977
Echo: PetLifeRadio.
00:35:10.977 --> 00:35:13.177
<v SPEAKER_5>petliferadio.com.
00:35:21.253 --> 00:35:22.113
Echo: Can we check it?
00:35:22.113 --> 00:35:33.193
Echo: They don't usually live in the yard, but when my Amazon delivery person opened the gate, and Marilyn Monroe ran out, and she's kind of my spicy girl.
00:35:33.193 --> 00:35:39.173
Echo: I have a real long driveway, I mean, you know, you've been to my house, and so she was running, and I was just like, where are you going?
00:35:39.173 --> 00:35:45.133
Echo: This was one instance where the question of, why did the chicken cross the road, really did cross my mind, because there was no reason for it.
00:35:46.333 --> 00:35:48.173
Echo: And we're actually live.
00:35:49.553 --> 00:35:55.413
Nessie: Anyway, we did finally answer, why the chicken crossed the road, in case you guys missed it, and you did.
00:35:55.413 --> 00:35:55.993
Echo: You did.
00:35:55.993 --> 00:35:56.593
Echo: So sorry.
00:35:56.593 --> 00:36:00.893
Echo: All right, let's talk about feline aortic thromboembolism.
00:36:00.893 --> 00:36:02.013
Echo: I know I hate this subject.
00:36:02.013 --> 00:36:04.513
Echo: This is another sad one, so we're going to need a good review after this.
00:36:04.513 --> 00:36:14.473
Echo: So feline aortic thromboembolism, it's also called fate, F-A-T, and it's more colloquially called the saddle thrombus.
00:36:14.473 --> 00:36:19.193
Echo: It's a sudden, extremely painful, and life-threatening condition.
00:36:19.193 --> 00:36:22.773
Echo: So do you want to break down what a thromboembolism is?
00:36:22.773 --> 00:36:31.353
Nessie: It is a blood clot that makes its way into the spinal cord and causes paralysis in the lower limbs.
00:36:31.353 --> 00:36:32.553
Echo: You're very close.
00:36:32.553 --> 00:36:35.053
Echo: The thrombus is a blood clot, right?
00:36:35.133 --> 00:36:37.813
Echo: And an embolism is a blood clot in a very bad place.
00:36:37.813 --> 00:36:42.733
Echo: A saddle is the place where the aorta splits into the left and right iliac arteries.
00:36:42.733 --> 00:36:45.473
Echo: So not quite the spinal cord.
00:36:45.473 --> 00:36:51.153
Echo: When the aorta splits, the left and the right iliac arteries go to the left and the right leg.
00:36:51.153 --> 00:36:57.053
Echo: So since those are the main blood supplies to each back leg, a thromboembolism.
00:36:57.053 --> 00:36:57.633
Echo: Embolism?
00:36:57.633 --> 00:36:58.193
Echo: Thank you.
00:36:58.193 --> 00:36:59.733
Echo: A thromboembolism.
00:36:59.733 --> 00:37:01.573
Echo: These are hard words.
00:37:01.573 --> 00:37:04.053
Echo: From people who are in the business, these are hard words.
00:37:04.513 --> 00:37:17.573
Echo: So a saddle thrombus, thromboembolism, is when there's a blood clot in the aorta, gets to the place where the aorta splits into two smaller arteries, the clot stays right there because it's too big.
00:37:17.573 --> 00:37:20.773
Echo: It gets stuck where the main blood supply feeds the back legs.
00:37:20.773 --> 00:37:26.133
Echo: So then that causes a lot of problems, like right at that saddle area.
00:37:26.133 --> 00:37:29.953
Nessie: Rhealysis and the limbs get cold and there's so much pain.
00:37:29.953 --> 00:37:30.153
Echo: Yes.
00:37:30.953 --> 00:37:31.333
Echo: Dr.
00:37:31.333 --> 00:37:35.793
Echo: Wendy Brooks is a board-certified specialist in canine and feline practice.
00:37:35.793 --> 00:37:39.713
Echo: She wrote an article for our favorite website, Veterinary Partner.
00:37:39.713 --> 00:37:40.693
Echo: Yay!
00:37:40.693 --> 00:37:44.173
Echo: She wrote about saddle thrombus, detailed out why this is such a devastating condition.
00:37:44.173 --> 00:37:45.993
Echo: I'm just going to highlight a few things about it.
00:37:45.993 --> 00:37:54.453
Echo: Most cats that have an episode of saddle thrombus will have an underlying cardiac disease, which is likely the reason why there was a clot in the orta in the first place.
00:37:54.453 --> 00:37:59.993
Echo: Saddle thrombus cuts off circulation to the back legs, which is why they get cold, right?
00:37:59.993 --> 00:38:01.933
Echo: And that causes tissue damage.
00:38:01.933 --> 00:38:05.013
Echo: The tissue damage generates a lot of toxic biochemicals.
00:38:05.013 --> 00:38:13.793
Echo: So when the clot dissolves, these toxic biochemicals are released into the cat's circulatory system, and that can be lethal even if there isn't heart failure.
00:38:13.793 --> 00:38:31.133
Echo: If the clot dissolves and the cat then recovers from this episode, there's still going to be after effects like heart failure, which will need to be addressed by a cardiologist, and tissue damage, which sometimes can show as loose skin or loose muscle, or even as open wounds in extreme cases.
00:38:31.133 --> 00:38:32.793
Echo: That could require an amputation.
00:38:32.793 --> 00:38:37.573
Echo: Many cats, even if they recover from an episode of Saddle Thrombus, will die anyway.
00:38:37.573 --> 00:38:48.193
Echo: Some will be overcome by a heart failure, some will throw another clot, maybe to the brain this time or to the lung, or from circulation of those toxic biochemicals from the tissue.
00:38:48.193 --> 00:38:50.093
Echo: Have you seen Saddle Thrombus before?
00:38:50.173 --> 00:38:50.593
Echo: I have.
00:38:50.593 --> 00:38:51.693
Echo: Yeah, I have, too.
00:38:51.693 --> 00:38:54.033
Nessie: It was not a very nice kitty.
00:38:54.033 --> 00:38:57.613
Nessie: We could barely even handle the kitty in the first place.
00:38:57.613 --> 00:39:01.093
Nessie: So he had to be sedated, which he wound up being euthanized.
00:39:01.093 --> 00:39:15.453
Echo: One of our doctors went on, I think it was her honeymoon, actually, and she was supposed to come back to work the next day, but she rushed in here with her new husband and her cat, and they euthanized immediately.
00:39:15.453 --> 00:39:22.073
Echo: Like, it was a flurry around me, and I didn't know what was going on, but that's when I first learned what title from this one is heartbreaking.
00:39:22.073 --> 00:39:23.213
Echo: It's terrible.
00:39:23.213 --> 00:39:24.473
Echo: We need a funny review.
00:39:24.473 --> 00:39:26.293
Echo: We need to laugh.
00:39:26.293 --> 00:39:26.953
Nessie: Help us out.
00:39:26.953 --> 00:39:29.113
Echo: I got a laugh for you.
00:39:29.113 --> 00:39:30.053
Echo: Excellent.
00:39:30.053 --> 00:39:33.233
Nessie: This is called dog pain away.
00:39:34.273 --> 00:39:34.713
Echo: Oh, no, no, no.
00:39:34.713 --> 00:39:35.613
Echo: It's different.
00:39:35.613 --> 00:39:39.193
Echo: Is it the same name as the, as the coconut?
00:39:39.193 --> 00:39:42.953
Nessie: That one is pet pain away.
00:39:42.953 --> 00:39:44.753
Echo: This is dog pain away.
00:39:45.833 --> 00:39:51.553
Nessie: It treats arthritis, inflammation, joint pain, and decreased flexibility.
00:39:51.553 --> 00:39:54.793
Nessie: Veterinarian approved it, it says on here, which I don't know how they determined that.
00:39:54.793 --> 00:39:58.153
Echo: Is it just one veterinarian that was like, hey, Bill, does this sound good?
00:39:58.153 --> 00:39:59.493
Echo: Lucky God.
00:40:00.653 --> 00:40:02.053
Nessie: Stamp it, get it out.
00:40:02.073 --> 00:40:05.513
Nessie: One star review from Amazon customer, verify purchase.
00:40:05.513 --> 00:40:09.533
Nessie: And I think I'm going to change Amazon customer to Amazonian, Amazonian or something.
00:40:09.533 --> 00:40:09.953
Nessie: I don't know.
00:40:09.953 --> 00:40:10.833
Nessie: Something more exotic.
00:40:10.933 --> 00:40:12.533
Nessie: It's Amazon customer, so I was boring, so.
00:40:12.533 --> 00:40:14.093
Nessie: This is Amazon warrior.
00:40:14.093 --> 00:40:16.573
Nessie: Okay, yeah, one star review.
00:40:16.573 --> 00:40:18.713
Nessie: Verify purchase called does not work.
00:40:18.713 --> 00:40:21.133
Nessie: Tic Tacs work as well as this does.
00:40:21.153 --> 00:40:25.813
Nessie: Used it for three weeks, saw zero improvement.
00:40:25.813 --> 00:40:27.593
Nessie: Took my bulldog to the vet.
00:40:27.593 --> 00:40:30.053
Nessie: They told us to grab two over-the-counter vitamins.
00:40:30.053 --> 00:40:31.753
Nessie: A week later, he's doing great.
00:40:31.753 --> 00:40:34.433
Nessie: And I paid way more for this than I did those vitamins.
00:40:34.433 --> 00:40:35.253
Nessie: Don't waste your money.
00:40:36.213 --> 00:40:41.453
Nessie: Well, now, first, I want to point out about Tic Tacs.
00:40:41.453 --> 00:40:45.713
Nessie: The regular Tic Tacs do not contain xylitol.
00:40:45.713 --> 00:40:50.993
Nessie: So those ones probably were okay, but was he actually giving the dog Tic Tacs?
00:40:50.993 --> 00:40:52.973
Echo: Do Tic Tacs now contain xylitol?
00:40:52.973 --> 00:41:01.173
Nessie: I think some of the more fancy, like when you get into like cherry flavor and strawberry flavor, I think those ones do, but the original regular Tic Tacs do not.
00:41:01.173 --> 00:41:01.813
Echo: Okay.
00:41:01.813 --> 00:41:04.013
Nessie: And maybe that's what he was actually using.
00:41:04.373 --> 00:41:07.153
Nessie: Sir, did you accidentally give your dog your Tic Tacs?
00:41:07.153 --> 00:41:12.173
Nessie: There was zero improvement until he went to the vet, and the vet gave him recommendation.
00:41:12.173 --> 00:41:14.153
Echo: Would you follow the vet's recommendation?
00:41:14.153 --> 00:41:15.153
Echo: The dog felt better.
00:41:15.153 --> 00:41:18.233
Nessie: Which is wild, because this says, veterinary recommended on the bottle.
00:41:18.233 --> 00:41:21.333
Nessie: And then he went to his actual veterinary, and it was not recommended.
00:41:21.333 --> 00:41:22.893
Echo: Well, crazy.
00:41:22.893 --> 00:41:26.033
Echo: How do you know which vet is right and which isn't?
00:41:26.033 --> 00:41:29.853
Nessie: I'm going to trust the one that I went and seen in person, because he's the one who put his hands in his...
00:41:29.933 --> 00:41:30.283
Echo: Yep...
00:41:30.283 --> 00:41:30.283
Nessie: .
00:41:30.283 --> 00:41:30.973
Nessie: him or her.
00:41:32.093 --> 00:41:33.523
Echo: Yep...
00:41:33.523 --> 00:41:33.523
Nessie: .
00:41:33.523 --> 00:41:36.373
Nessie: their in the room, in the situation.
00:41:36.373 --> 00:41:39.533
Nessie: So I'm taking their advice over whatever...
00:41:39.533 --> 00:41:40.043
Echo: Yeah...
00:41:40.043 --> 00:41:40.043
Nessie: .
00:41:40.043 --> 00:41:44.113
Nessie: whatever Bob they went and talked to that stamped to the bottle.
00:41:44.113 --> 00:41:45.093
Nessie: And was like, I proved it.
00:41:45.093 --> 00:41:47.713
Nessie: It looks like a pill.
00:41:47.713 --> 00:41:49.493
Echo: No, it's like a pill.
00:41:49.493 --> 00:41:50.233
Echo: That's for sure.
00:41:50.233 --> 00:42:12.933
Echo: There are a number of other mobility issues that we didn't cover in last episode in this one, but I think the two other ones that I feel like we see are like muscle atrophy, which is when muscles waste away due to age or ill-is or inactivity, but it just kind of makes the pet weaker, and they can struggle to walk or run or jump like they used to.
00:42:12.933 --> 00:42:16.653
Echo: But neurologic disorders can also cause mobility issues too.
00:42:16.653 --> 00:42:20.313
Echo: And when certain symptoms are noticed, the pet should be evaluated by a veterinarian.
00:42:20.653 --> 00:42:27.113
Echo: What do you feel like are the most common mobility-type neurologic symptoms?
00:42:27.113 --> 00:42:32.353
Echo: Like things that you notice that are mobility issues that make you go, oh, that's neurologic.
00:42:32.353 --> 00:42:35.613
Nessie: The knuckling is a big one.
00:42:35.613 --> 00:42:44.313
Nessie: Sometimes that ataxia is a pretty good bit, especially if there's a head tilt or something involved with that that's throwing off their balance.
00:42:44.313 --> 00:42:45.933
Echo: Circling was my main.
00:42:45.933 --> 00:42:47.093
Echo: Circling, constant circling.
00:42:47.093 --> 00:42:55.793
Echo: Weakness, I think, just in the hind limbs especially, can be a symptom of some neurologic disorders, muscle tremors, twitching, trembling, that kind of thing.
00:42:55.793 --> 00:42:56.293
Echo: Okay.
00:42:57.893 --> 00:42:59.753
Echo: I didn't have a whole lot on that.
00:42:59.753 --> 00:43:01.193
Echo: Quick little Zadibit.
00:43:01.193 --> 00:43:02.933
Nessie: I'm sorry, I don't like a Zadibit.
00:43:02.933 --> 00:43:05.733
Nessie: This is Three Stars by Aldi.
00:43:05.733 --> 00:43:07.713
Nessie: Aldi, for that same product.
00:43:07.713 --> 00:43:09.913
Echo: I thought they were plum and goat cheese pizza.
00:43:11.473 --> 00:43:13.933
Nessie: What?
00:43:13.933 --> 00:43:15.173
Echo: Aldi, the grocery store?
00:43:15.353 --> 00:43:20.133
Echo: Yes, they have a frozen pizza that isn't plums and goat cheese.
00:43:20.133 --> 00:43:20.713
Echo: It's really good.
00:43:20.713 --> 00:43:21.853
Echo: Okay.
00:43:21.853 --> 00:43:24.993
Echo: It sounds gross now that I say it out loud, but it is phenomenal.
00:43:24.993 --> 00:43:26.093
Echo: You can die of smell that.
00:43:26.093 --> 00:43:27.313
Nessie: Believe me.
00:43:27.313 --> 00:43:28.373
Nessie: I definitely believe you.
00:43:29.973 --> 00:43:31.653
Nessie: This is Dawn Pain Away again.
00:43:31.653 --> 00:43:32.433
Nessie: Okay, say one.
00:43:32.433 --> 00:43:33.753
Nessie: And this one's Three Star.
00:43:33.753 --> 00:43:34.473
Echo: Uh-oh.
00:43:34.733 --> 00:43:36.393
Nessie: I'm by Precious by Aldi.
00:43:36.393 --> 00:43:42.073
Nessie: Not sure since my dog can't tell me that she's feeling better, and I can't see any difference.
00:43:42.073 --> 00:43:46.353
Nessie: Wish I could write a better review since I depend on them for everything that I buy online.
00:43:46.353 --> 00:43:49.353
Echo: So this is either it works or it doesn't, and I'm not sure.
00:43:49.353 --> 00:43:52.733
Nessie: Right, which is why it's just a nice middle one there.
00:43:52.733 --> 00:43:55.073
Nessie: And you're like, I don't know, my dog can't tell me.
00:43:55.073 --> 00:43:59.413
Echo: Do you have the overall stars of the product?
00:43:59.413 --> 00:44:00.993
Nessie: About 4.1.
00:44:01.013 --> 00:44:03.453
Echo: Oh, so there are people that like it.
00:44:03.453 --> 00:44:06.653
Echo: Have you tried any of these products that you've been talking about?
00:44:06.653 --> 00:44:07.393
Nessie: These?
00:44:07.393 --> 00:44:09.293
Nessie: No, no, no, no.
00:44:09.353 --> 00:44:09.913
Echo: No way.
00:44:10.193 --> 00:44:10.533
Nessie: No way.
00:44:10.533 --> 00:44:14.493
Nessie: I'm not into smoke-fine snake venom or snake oil.
00:44:14.493 --> 00:44:17.593
Echo: Or her community got to this, and food loves it.
00:44:17.593 --> 00:44:19.953
Nessie: Turmeric with black pepper, they're just not really...
00:44:19.953 --> 00:44:22.393
Echo: Like, put that on my eggs, please.
00:44:22.393 --> 00:44:27.933
Nessie: Oh, well, if you want me to try it as the seasoning for my eggs on the week.
00:44:27.933 --> 00:44:28.753
Echo: Does it come in a cap?
00:44:28.753 --> 00:44:30.853
Echo: Will you just open up that cap and just sprinkle, sprinkle?
00:44:30.853 --> 00:44:32.273
Echo: Sprinkle, sprinkle.
00:44:32.933 --> 00:44:34.493
Nessie: Well, no, I have not.
00:44:34.493 --> 00:44:43.073
Echo: So really, at the first sign of any of these mobility concerns, you know, the first step is always going to be to consult your vet.
00:44:43.073 --> 00:44:54.713
Echo: As someone who works with an orthopedic surgeon, like what are the common recommendations or things that pet parents can do to help with their pets with, with any of these mobility issues?
00:44:54.713 --> 00:45:05.333
Nessie: First of all, if you have a pet that is suffering from arthritis, as we may have mentioned in that last song, if you paid it into, age is not a disease, right?
00:45:05.333 --> 00:45:09.693
Nessie: So arthritis is also not the end of mobility for your dog.
00:45:09.693 --> 00:45:17.633
Nessie: It is important that even if you're used to maybe taking a dog on like a three mile walk or run or whatever every day, still take them, but cut that down.
00:45:17.633 --> 00:45:19.313
Nessie: You don't want to go past a mile anymore.
00:45:19.713 --> 00:45:22.973
Nessie: You want to keep it at a mile, but keeping them active is going to help a lot.
00:45:22.973 --> 00:45:28.673
Nessie: Letting them get stiff and keeping them around the house more and more resting is not going to help.
00:45:29.133 --> 00:45:34.453
Nessie: You want to keep those joints moving and warm to a reasonable degree.
00:45:34.453 --> 00:45:36.693
Nessie: You want to incorporate fish oils.
00:45:36.693 --> 00:45:37.353
Echo: Fish oils.
00:45:37.353 --> 00:45:37.813
Nessie: Yes.
00:45:37.813 --> 00:45:40.093
Nessie: I always be getting my seasoning stuff around there.
00:45:40.093 --> 00:45:42.833
Echo: Cosyquin chondroitin?
00:45:42.833 --> 00:45:44.973
Echo: Was that what you were thinking?
00:45:44.973 --> 00:45:46.513
Nessie: Yeah, the common joint one.
00:45:46.513 --> 00:45:52.273
Echo: Glucosamine, MSM and chondroitin are like the three heavy hitters of joint support.
00:45:52.273 --> 00:45:54.413
Nessie: So glucosamine is great.
00:45:55.233 --> 00:45:56.913
Nessie: It helps rebuild cartilage, right?
00:45:56.913 --> 00:45:58.593
Nessie: Or it helps with cartilage.
00:45:58.593 --> 00:46:06.293
Nessie: The only thing is the dogs don't keep as much of it and use as much of it as you would have thought when you're giving them these supplements.
00:46:06.293 --> 00:46:08.533
Nessie: They get way more out of the fish oils.
00:46:08.533 --> 00:46:09.013
Echo: Really?
00:46:09.013 --> 00:46:10.033
Echo: I always, okay.
00:46:10.033 --> 00:46:14.413
Echo: So I always thought fish oils were for skin and coats.
00:46:14.413 --> 00:46:17.433
Nessie: They are also a great lubricant for their joints.
00:46:17.433 --> 00:46:19.893
Nessie: And they have anti-inflammatory properties as well.
00:46:20.473 --> 00:46:27.233
Nessie: But if you're going to start a pet on fish oil, you don't want to go straight to the recommended dose for their weight.
00:46:27.233 --> 00:46:31.313
Nessie: You want to work your way up to it because you are going to wind up with runny stools.
00:46:31.313 --> 00:46:33.253
Echo: That is very good to know.
00:46:33.253 --> 00:46:36.873
Echo: I didn't know any of that because you were just talking to me like, well, I should get some fish oils.
00:46:36.873 --> 00:46:37.113
Nessie: Yeah.
00:46:37.113 --> 00:46:42.493
Echo: I always thought it was for skin and coat, but it's skin, coat, joints, anything.
00:46:42.493 --> 00:46:43.873
Echo: Fish oil is not snake oil.
00:46:43.873 --> 00:46:45.093
Nessie: Fish oil is not snake oil.
00:46:45.093 --> 00:46:45.973
Echo: Fish oil is the real stuff.
00:46:45.973 --> 00:46:46.433
Nessie: Yeah.
00:46:46.433 --> 00:46:47.653
Nessie: I would go with that over the venom.
00:46:47.833 --> 00:46:50.473
Echo: Yeah.
00:46:50.473 --> 00:46:56.713
Nessie: And work your way up to the recommended dosing, or else you are going to have some runny bopes.
00:46:56.713 --> 00:46:57.693
Echo: We had a dog.
00:46:57.693 --> 00:46:59.093
Echo: Her name was Pearl.
00:46:59.093 --> 00:47:00.653
Echo: Pearl's the girl.
00:47:00.653 --> 00:47:06.353
Echo: She came in for surgery, and we've seen her for a lot of her rechecks, but man, does that dog smell like fish oil.
00:47:06.353 --> 00:47:08.773
Echo: They get fish oil, and oh my god.
00:47:08.773 --> 00:47:09.753
Echo: She thinks.
00:47:09.753 --> 00:47:10.773
Nessie: Yeah.
00:47:10.773 --> 00:47:11.793
Echo: It's in her pores now.
00:47:12.673 --> 00:47:15.873
Nessie: Well, I think you get a little bit of it.
00:47:15.873 --> 00:47:18.133
Echo: Say their dogs.
00:47:18.133 --> 00:47:18.793
Echo: I don't know.
00:47:18.793 --> 00:47:21.073
Nessie: Don't bathe them in fish oil, maybe.
00:47:22.853 --> 00:47:24.553
Nessie: That doesn't have the same effects.
00:47:24.553 --> 00:47:25.593
Echo: No, but it doesn't.
00:47:25.593 --> 00:47:33.053
Nessie: And then, of course, regularly taking them to get their physical exams with the doctor to monitor mobility and things like that is important, but yes.
00:47:33.053 --> 00:47:34.213
Nessie: Yeah, those are the big things.
00:47:34.373 --> 00:47:38.553
Nessie: Keep them active, offer some visual, and see you back.
00:47:38.553 --> 00:47:38.933
Echo: Yeah.
00:47:38.933 --> 00:47:39.913
Echo: Do you have one more review?
00:47:39.913 --> 00:47:40.773
Echo: I do.
00:47:40.773 --> 00:47:42.533
Echo: I can find one.
00:47:42.533 --> 00:47:45.693
Nessie: This one is back to those two right ones.
00:47:45.693 --> 00:47:49.353
Nessie: The two right black pepper, curcumin.
00:47:49.353 --> 00:47:53.693
Nessie: It is three stars by the vegan.
00:47:53.693 --> 00:47:54.373
Echo: Okay.
00:47:54.373 --> 00:47:55.993
Nessie: Three star verified purchase.
00:47:55.993 --> 00:47:56.613
Echo: That makes sense.
00:47:56.613 --> 00:47:58.853
Nessie: It's called, I thought it was vegan friendly.
00:47:58.853 --> 00:48:00.753
Echo: Is it not?
00:48:00.753 --> 00:48:02.133
Echo: It sounds like just spices.
00:48:02.493 --> 00:48:03.793
Echo: Remember for the Mexican chihuahua.
00:48:04.833 --> 00:48:08.253
Nessie: I thought it was vegan friendly because it says no animal byproducts.
00:48:08.253 --> 00:48:10.293
Nessie: I was happy and bought it right away.
00:48:10.293 --> 00:48:14.313
Nessie: But most likely the chondroitin isn't from plant sources.
00:48:14.313 --> 00:48:19.533
Nessie: So I assume I was misled and fed my healthy vegan dogs a non-vegan product.
00:48:20.793 --> 00:48:23.833
Echo: How can you hunt vegan dogs?
00:48:23.833 --> 00:48:25.533
Nessie: I'm not sure.
00:48:25.533 --> 00:48:27.573
Nessie: Plant-based proteins.
00:48:27.573 --> 00:48:30.833
Nessie: I mean, I know that they are, dogs are not meant to be vegan.
00:48:31.573 --> 00:48:33.793
Echo: No, I mean, they're omnivores, right?
00:48:33.793 --> 00:48:35.733
Echo: They're not just straight carnivores, or are they?
00:48:35.733 --> 00:48:37.673
Echo: I just did a quick Google search.
00:48:38.713 --> 00:48:46.773
Echo: And this says that chondroitin is derived from shark, bovine or pig cartilage, but it can be produced synthetically.
00:48:46.773 --> 00:48:50.673
Echo: That sounds like you cannot get chondroitin from plants.
00:48:51.553 --> 00:48:56.913
Nessie: Okay, I never see them eat food, fruit, well, I guess they're cut grass.
00:48:56.913 --> 00:48:59.753
Echo: I've never seen them eat food.
00:48:59.753 --> 00:49:01.553
Nessie: Well, like plants and stuff is what I meant.
00:49:01.553 --> 00:49:03.433
Nessie: I don't, they're not out here looking for a sap.
00:49:03.433 --> 00:49:06.333
Echo: I mean, Sam chews on the grass all the time.
00:49:06.333 --> 00:49:06.653
Echo: Yeah.
00:49:06.653 --> 00:49:07.553
Echo: But I mean-
00:49:07.553 --> 00:49:10.113
Nessie: I wanted to just put my nibbles on some grass.
00:49:10.113 --> 00:49:12.513
Nessie: I just wouldn't figure out, I don't know what to do for a carnivore.
00:49:12.513 --> 00:49:14.753
Nessie: But you know, we give them snaps that are-
00:49:15.293 --> 00:49:17.273
Echo: Is vegan friendly?
00:49:17.273 --> 00:49:21.313
Echo: It can be synthetically derived, like you can make it synthetically.
00:49:21.313 --> 00:49:23.753
Echo: So, but it's not from plants.
00:49:23.753 --> 00:49:28.693
Echo: It's either from like an animal, like you were saying, it's like a cartilage.
00:49:28.693 --> 00:49:30.353
Echo: It's a key component of cartilage.
00:49:30.353 --> 00:49:32.633
Nessie: Well, even if it was synthetic, would it make it vegan?
00:49:32.633 --> 00:49:33.713
Echo: Let's see here.
00:49:33.713 --> 00:49:34.053
Echo: It is?
00:49:34.053 --> 00:49:36.453
Echo: Either way, you've ruined your vegan dogs.
00:49:36.533 --> 00:49:39.073
Echo: Synthetikondroitlen, vegan.
00:49:39.073 --> 00:49:42.793
Echo: Google says, yes, some Synthetikondroitlen is vegan.
00:49:42.793 --> 00:49:46.293
Nessie: Girl, just look it up and make sure it was synthetic, okay?
00:49:46.293 --> 00:49:50.133
Nessie: That way you can keep your vegan dogs vegan and out, you know?
00:49:50.173 --> 00:49:52.013
Echo: Oh dear.
00:49:52.013 --> 00:49:53.413
Nessie: All right, wrap up, vegan dogs.
00:49:55.113 --> 00:49:56.073
Echo: Yeah.
00:49:56.073 --> 00:49:58.653
Nessie: Is there anything new that you learned from this episode?
00:49:58.673 --> 00:50:01.313
Echo: Anything that sticks out to you or that you found particularly interesting?
00:50:01.493 --> 00:50:06.253
Nessie: Probably, I guess, clearing up exactly where that blood clot was, was very helpful for me.
00:50:07.653 --> 00:50:10.753
Nessie: I guess I never really dug that deep into it.
00:50:10.753 --> 00:50:13.453
Nessie: I just knew it was a blood clot somewhere.
00:50:13.453 --> 00:50:16.913
Echo: Yeah, somewhere bad that stopped the legs and whatnot.
00:50:16.913 --> 00:50:18.333
Echo: Yeah.
00:50:18.333 --> 00:50:21.813
Echo: I've never had any experience with degenerative myelopathy before.
00:50:21.813 --> 00:50:23.993
Echo: Didn't even know what it was, so that was interesting.
00:50:23.993 --> 00:50:28.613
Echo: And then also to find out that one of my favorite patients had it.
00:50:28.853 --> 00:50:31.493
Echo: Like, I didn't have a good time researching some of these.
00:50:31.493 --> 00:50:33.853
Nessie: No, so it's not great.
00:50:33.853 --> 00:50:38.093
Nessie: But there are things that we can do to help offer the best quality of life possible.
00:50:38.093 --> 00:50:38.513
Echo: Yes.
00:50:38.513 --> 00:50:49.413
Echo: If you're a pet owner listening to this episode and you want to learn more about your pet, I know it can be difficult sometimes to distinguish which websites have accurate information and which websites will offer you some dangerous advice.
00:50:49.413 --> 00:50:53.493
Echo: But one of the best resources out there for you is going to be veterinary partner.
00:50:53.493 --> 00:50:56.093
Echo: We love veterinary partner.
00:50:56.093 --> 00:50:57.173
Echo: We are not sponsored by them.
00:50:58.093 --> 00:51:03.153
Echo: But that website has articles written by board-certified specialists specifically for pet owners.
00:51:03.153 --> 00:51:06.933
Echo: So if you're going to get on Google, definitely get on veterinary partner.
00:51:06.933 --> 00:51:08.373
Nessie: Check there first.
00:51:08.373 --> 00:51:08.933
Echo: Okay.
00:51:08.933 --> 00:51:10.253
Echo: And so that's it.
00:51:10.253 --> 00:51:11.253
Echo: That's all we got.
00:51:11.253 --> 00:51:18.093
Nessie: We will hit you up with a different version of a nice mobility song.
00:51:18.093 --> 00:51:18.653
Echo: I'm ready.
00:51:18.653 --> 00:51:19.253
Echo: I'm ready for it.
00:51:19.253 --> 00:51:21.513
Nessie: Pulled out some interesting genres.
00:51:23.213 --> 00:51:24.693
Nessie: Got some interesting dance moves going as well.
00:51:24.693 --> 00:51:25.173
Echo: That's right.
00:51:25.173 --> 00:51:26.053
Echo: That's right.
00:51:26.053 --> 00:51:32.313
Nessie: You can find our handles for our social medias and stuff in the show notes.
00:51:32.333 --> 00:51:39.913
Nessie: And also the bibliography information is going to be there as well so that you can dive into some of these topics on your own if you'd like.
00:51:39.913 --> 00:51:42.893
Nessie: If you wanted to email us, you can reach us at bluh, bluh.
00:51:42.893 --> 00:51:43.873
Echo: I used to bluh, bluh.
00:51:43.873 --> 00:51:45.373
Nessie: Bluh, bluh.
00:51:46.453 --> 00:51:48.873
Nessie: B-L-U-H, I don't know.
00:51:48.873 --> 00:51:49.933
Echo: That was close.
00:51:49.933 --> 00:51:50.613
Nessie: Yeah, we'll go with that.
00:51:51.273 --> 00:51:52.533
Nessie: Here is the email address.
00:51:52.533 --> 00:51:53.873
Echo: It is letstalkatpetliferadio.com.
00:51:55.433 --> 00:51:57.853
Nessie: Come on, Pet Pals, let's have a chat.
00:51:57.853 --> 00:52:02.153
Nessie: And we can, if you find your own reviews that you think are funny, send them in.
00:52:02.153 --> 00:52:03.133
Nessie: We'll use them on the show.
00:52:03.133 --> 00:52:04.633
Nessie: We'll get you your credit.
00:52:04.633 --> 00:52:06.673
Nessie: And that's it.
00:52:06.673 --> 00:52:07.553
Echo: Thank you for joining us.
00:52:07.553 --> 00:52:08.213
Nessie: Thank you.
00:52:08.313 --> 00:52:08.753
Echo: Bye.
00:54:12.987 --> 00:54:18.927
Announcer: Let's Talk Pets, every week, on demand, only on petliferadio.com.